Papa's Got A Brand New Bag (James Brown, 1965) ...

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Certainly makes it nice and simple.

So, let me think, the boys get the "tired" officials? Parents of girls have to rush home from work to see the game, but parents of boys can just leisurely drive home, get a bite, and go to the game?

Girls coaches complaint: "Crews don't give full effort in our games because they have to work another game after."

Boys coaches complaint: "Crews are tired because they had to work a game right before ours."

Only way we would have separate crews is if schools started playing girls and boys on different nights. Not going to happen.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by SC Official

Only way we would have separate crews is if schools started playing girls and boys on different nights.

Back when I started, almost forty years ago, it was almost universal that boys played Tuesday and Friday nights, and girls played on Mondays and Thursdays (we use to have our board meetings on Wednesday nights).

Nice setup, especially for schools with one gymnasium. No need to close the folding doors and split the gym for practice (except for Wednesdays). Teams were guaranteed a full gym on at least two weekday afternoons, at convenient times right after school.

Plenty of officials to work both genders over four different nights.

Why it changed, I don't know?

Some schools now use a "one gender home, the other gender on the road" schedule, and some apparently schedule with a pair of fuzzy dice.

Now we have our board meetings on Sunday mornings, which pisses off those who want to attend religious services with their families.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by SC Official

Girls coaches complaint: "Crews don't give full effort in our games because they have to work another game after." Boys coaches complaint: "Crews are tired because they had to work a game right before ours."

[BillyMac]

Who wants to have more fun?

Cheerleaders.

At all the home games, both genders? Always at boys games (home and on the road)?

[ODog]

For us, most of our top officials are assigned zero (or very few) girls games, and that's just the way it works. No opt-in/opt-out or choosing required.

Boys and girls generally play on different nights, but that doesn't change the fact that some of our top dogs will just get a night off on "girls nights." They don't have to request no girls. Our assignor just does it that way.

Other top officials may get a smattering of girls, says 6-8 games out of 35. I can't think of any "good" officials in our area who do even 40 percent girls games.

So in our area, girls definitely get lower-quality officials -- and fewer three-person crews -- and that's just life.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by ODog

For us, most of our top officials are assigned zero (or very few) girls games, and that's just the way it works. No opt-in/opt-out or choosing required.

Boys and girls generally play on different nights, but that doesn't change the fact that some of our top dogs will just get a night off on "girls nights." They don't have to request no girls. Our assignor just does it that way.

Other top officials may get a smattering of girls, says 6-8 games out of 35. I can't think of any "good" officials in our area who do even 40 percent girls games.

So in our area, girls definitely get lower-quality officials -- and fewer three-person crews -- and that's just life.

Pretty much how it works here. I only get asked to work a girls game as a "favor" to the assignor that might assign both. And the rest never even attempt to ask because they already know the answer. I also work college which takes up many of my off high school nights. It is really obvious when the state finals come and the lower classes clearly do not get the same quality of officials as the boys do as a general rule.

Originally Posted by johnny d

I am so happy I don't have to put up with this nonsense in Illinois. If I had to work girls games, I would never have started officiating high school basketball. It is pretty obvious in the Chicago area that the overall quality of girls officials is significantly lower than the boys officials. Most of the men doing high school girls games in this area are doing them because they were not good enough to get boys games or a full schedule of boys games.

And who cares what the principals, athletic directors, coaches, or Gloria Steinem thinks. As an independent contractor, I get to choose for whom and when I work. If they want better officials, they should make their product better.

Yes, yes and yes. This is not social justice we are talking about here. I have no desire to work girls basketball and only did it early on because it would get me experience. Now I have choices and I make no apologies for my choices. When I leave my house I have to be satisfied with what I am doing or I will stay home.

Peace

[Pantherdreams]

We don't choose or get opted into girls or boys. We let our assignor know what nights we are available and then games get assigned to us on that night. Our zone is pretty rural so everyone has to drive everywhere but other than a couple of outliers that require special scheduling all the little schools are in about a 90 minute radius. I could get a varsity and jv boys double header, a boys and girls doubel header, all girls, depends on what the school has on the docket. I had a night last year where I worked with a new official on middle school girls game, before a different partner showed up to work a varsity boys game with me.

Properly rated officials can be given playoff assignments. In our sectional playoffs officials cannot come from the local assigning zone, so we can be sent as pairs or individuals off to sectionals. There is an assigned chief for all weekend who makes the pairings for officials the 2nd day. Officials who officiate the sectional finals are short listed to provincial (state) finals. Overseeing board picks and pairs all officials from that list for finals.

There is no distinction made between girls/boys games in terms of who asks/gets/assigned to what.

[SC Official]

It should also be noted that in my state it's much more economical for the schools to pay officials for a DH than single games.

A single regular-season varsity game is $55 plus mileage ($0.45/mile both ways, minimum $9). A varsity DH is $78 plus mileage (at the same rate). i.e. When we work two games we aren't paid for two separate games ("you're already there").

The schools want to go to flat fees to help with budgeting so eventually that will probably happen, but I doubt that will result in any change to the way games are scheduled.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

...

Should I be allowed to request only games with mostly black players? Or mostly white players? Only at big schools? Only at small schools? Not out in farm country? Only at Catholic schools? Not at Catholic schools? Not at deaf schools?

...

Does your state have black basketball and non-black basketball? Farm basketball and non-farm basketball?

My state has girls basketball and boys basketball. My state has private school basketball and public school basketball.

I can choose to travel long distances (farm country) or not.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Good thought.

Thanks for reading my lengthy post...

I didn't read all of your original post, I skimmed through and portions caught my attention.

Also, you added quite a bit to your post after I had already responded.

[Rich]

I assign varsity games only for 24 schools. I can hire whoever I want.

There are a few officials where I will honor a boys-only request. I know these officials, many of them work college for an assigner who will not allow them to work any girls/women hoops. They're good people, they ask in the right way, and they appreciate what they do get from me.

There are a few officials who have asked for boys only because they see the first group getting boys only -- and I told them if they don't work girls, they aren't getting anything. They haven't earned that from me or other assigners here (one crew I remember had about 4 years experience). No skin off my whatever.

I've always worked both. The one year I decided to only work boys games, I got assigned to work the state tournament for girls. At that point I simply started working girls games again. The conversations with assigners here were awkward, too.

How do I feel about the whole "girls officials are worse" thing?

Regarding ratings -- if you put the same people from boys games onto girls games, their ratings would be worse. That's my experience -- my boys ratings are considerably higher than my girls ratings EVERY YEAR. I won't call every little bump a foul and many of those coaches expect that.

Furthermore, I find it much easier to work a boys game. Much easier to get into a rhythm, much easier to make a call/no-call decision on contact, etc.

Finally, as someone who has now assigned for 5 years -- those who think they're great officials aren't always so in the eyes of the schools and coaches. And I've weeded out people who really don't want to be at my smaller schools, too.

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by Rich

I know these officials, many of them work college for an assigner who will not allow them to work any girls/women hoops.

"Independent contractors"

[Rich]

Originally Posted by SC Official

"Independent contractors"

Exactly. And these are D3 assigners, too, who think way too highly of themselves.

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by Rich

Finally, as someone who has now assigned for 5 years -- those who think they're great officials aren't always so in the eyes of the schools and coaches. And I've weeded out people who really don't want to be at my smaller schools, too.

We have plenty like that here, and many of them go far in the postseason. But the schools can scratch a generous number of officials (I think 8?) so that kind of solves the issue of schools/coaches not liking certain officials.

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by Rich

Exactly. And these are D3 assigners, too, who think way too highly of themselves.

Thankfully small college assigners in this region don't make those demands. Would be asinine given that high school games in GA, SC, and NC are all assigned as G/B DHs.