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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Mon Feb 12, 2018, 04:08pm
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OOB plays - TO timeframe and delays

May I solicit rules and interpretations on these plays:

(1) Team-A (behind at the end of a game) scores a 2-point basket and then Team-B quickly grabs the ball and (a) is on the way with possession of the ball OOB OR (b) already OOB with the ball - BOTH prior the official starting the 5-second count....can Team-A legally still call a TO ? I say yes as the official has not yet started their 5-second count. Rule/Opinion?

(2) Team-A scores a basket with 10.0 seconds left on the clock - Team-B has no more TO's. Team-B then delays on taking the ball OOB for a throw-in. Team-B finally picks up the ball for a throw-in @ 7.0 seconds. Do you: 1) start the 5-second count earlier OR 2) blow the whistle to stop the clock to issue a 'delay' warning to Team-B?
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Old Mon Feb 12, 2018, 04:17pm
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1a) Yes, grant the TO; 1b) This is kind of a circular question, and we don't know whether the official was correct in not starting the count. But, the "expiration of time to grant a TO" and "the proper time to start the count" occur at the same instant.

2) It's never a delay warning. Start the count if the ball is available to B (or whatever the specific rule book wording is)
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Old Mon Feb 12, 2018, 04:42pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bd41flpk View Post
May I solicit rules and interpretations on these plays:

(1) Team-A (behind at the end of a game) scores a 2-point basket and then Team-B quickly grabs the ball .... (b) already OOB with the ball - BOTH prior the official starting the 5-second count....can Team-A legally still call a TO ? I say yes as the official has not yet started their 5-second count. Rule/Opinion?
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
1a) Yes, grant the TO; 1b) This is kind of a circular question, and we don't know whether the official was correct in not starting the count. But, the "expiration of time to grant a TO" and "the proper time to start the count" occur at the same instant.
For me, in situation (b), I consider it too late and start a count when the player is OOB AND has turned around (ignoring deliberate delay). I have never seen a player make a throwin with his/her back to the court and I think they should have the 5 full seconds to make the throwin.
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Old Mon Feb 12, 2018, 04:47pm
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Originally Posted by Camron Rust View Post
For me, in situation (b), I consider it too late and start a count when the player is OOB AND has turned around (ignoring deliberate delay). I have never seen a player make a throwin with his/her back to the court and I think they should have the 5 full seconds to make the throwin.
I agree -- and meant to put that example in my reply. thanks for adding it.
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Old Mon Feb 12, 2018, 05:20pm
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OOB plays - TO timeframe and delays

Thank you for the replies.....

May I construe that the Team-A (who has just scored) has the capability to call a TO up to the point of when the official has 'commenced' his/her 5-second count? The answer would be twofold: 1) Team-B member has the ball OOB and 2) the official now recognizes that Team-B member is at the 'ready' to start the inbound pass ( e.g. is now facing the court with the ball.

Thank you.....
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Old Mon Feb 12, 2018, 06:40pm
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Originally Posted by bd41flpk View Post
Thank you for the replies.....

May I construe that the Team-A (who has just scored) has the capability to call a TO up to the point of when the official has 'commenced' his/her 5-second count? The answer would be twofold: 1) Team-B member has the ball OOB and 2) the official now recognizes that Team-B member is at the 'ready' to start the inbound pass ( e.g. is now facing the court with the ball.

Thank you.....
Yes
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Old Tue Feb 13, 2018, 08:23am
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Originally Posted by bd41flpk View Post
Thank you for the replies.....

May I construe that the Team-A (who has just scored) has the capability to call a TO up to the point of when the official has 'commenced' his/her 5-second count? The answer would be twofold: 1) Team-B member has the ball OOB and 2) the official now recognizes that Team-B member is at the 'ready' to start the inbound pass ( e.g. is now facing the court with the ball.

Thank you.....
Well...

Team A can be granted a TO until the ball is at the disposal of Team B. Once the ball is at the disposal, the count should begin.
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Old Tue Feb 13, 2018, 09:02am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
1a) Yes, grant the TO; 1b) This is kind of a circular question, and we don't know whether the official was correct in not starting the count. But, the "expiration of time to grant a TO" and "the proper time to start the count" occur at the same instant.

2) It's never a delay warning. Start the count if the ball is available to B (or whatever the specific rule book wording is)
2. I know it would be very unusual for this to happen, but I looked, where's the rule reference for your ruling on this type of play? After all, it is a delay of game.
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Old Tue Feb 13, 2018, 09:22am
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Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
2) It's never a delay warning. Start the count if the ball is available to B (or whatever the specific rule book wording is)
To piggy back on this response. Don't rush your count simply because of the time remaining in the game. Coaches think that time works differently at 5 minutes versus 10 seconds. Don't get caught up in that.
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Old Tue Feb 13, 2018, 09:24am
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Originally Posted by bbman View Post
2. I know it would be very unusual for this to happen, but I looked, where's the rule reference for your ruling on this type of play? After all, it is a delay of game.
The correct ruling for a violation here would be a 5 second inbounds violation. Delay of game has to do with a team that PREVENTS the game from continuing. If the defense swats the ball away it is a delay of game or a T (depending on time of game and the circumstances).
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Old Tue Feb 13, 2018, 09:27am
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Originally Posted by bbman View Post
2. I know it would be very unusual for this to happen, but I looked, where's the rule reference for your ruling on this type of play? After all, it is a delay of game.
I can't prove a negative. To be a delay warning, it must meet one of the 4 delay warning scenarios in 4-Warning (45? 47? something like that). It doesn't so it's not a warning

If you think B could have the ball OOB, and doesn't -- start the count.
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