The effect of a technical foul on a coach

[crosscountry55]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

On the floor and demonstrating? As close to an automatic as one can get.

Two small steps and more like a "whatever" gesture. I guess you had to be there. Normally I would agree with you, but this situation just seemed like it called for something more measured. Especially with the warning as an option this year.

[LRZ]

IMO, this is a much more important "taking care of business so the next crew doesn't have to" than fashion police issues. Recently, in a 9th grade game, I cautioned, officially warned, then finally T'd a coach. My partner said, "I've known him for years, he's always like that. He's always hyper." Apparently, no one before had ever told the coach that his conduct was unacceptable?

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by LRZ

IMO, this is a much more important "taking care of business so the next crew doesn't have to" than fashion police issues.

The difference is we all have our own lines in the sand with regards to behavior.

Fashion police rules are, well, rules, and it shouldn’t really matter what our opinion is.

[LRZ]

Originally Posted by SC Official

The difference is we all have our own lines in the sand with regards to behavior.

Fashion police rules are, well, rules, and it shouldn’t really matter what our opinion is.

I don't mean to minimize fashion police rules. What I meant was to compare the importance of TCOB re fashion rules and TCOB re coaches' behavior: if a crew does not enforce the fashion rules, and I have to do so the next game, no big deal, I do so. But crews that don't try to control coaches' misconduct? That's another story, entirely. In my little corner of PA, too many officials fail to TCOB about coaches' conduct--they have no line in the sand at all. Get in, collect the check, get out.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by LRZ

I don't mean to minimize fashion police rules. What I meant was to compare the importance of TCOB re fashion rules and TCOB re coaches' behavior: if a crew does not enforce the fashion rules, and I have to do so the next game, no big deal, I do so. But crews that don't try to control coaches' misconduct? That's another story, entirely. In my little corner of PA, too many officials fail to TCOB about coaches' conduct--they have no line in the sand at all. Get in, collect the check, get out.

Sounds great, but we are all different. What offends you, might be normal to me. What I can deal with, you might struggle with. If I have learned anything as an official, not everyone can handle the same kind of situations. So we can call Ts all over the place, that is not going to change how those react to them.

Peace

[SC Official]

I think coaches would collectively behave better if we got away from the stigma of technical fouls and just called them when warranted without worrying about all the repercussions. Incredible how much better NBA coaches behave than their high school and college counterparts, partially because NBA officials are not scared to TCOB when warranted.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by SC Official

I think coaches would collectively behave better if we got away from the stigma of technical fouls and just called them when warranted without worrying about all the repercussions. Incredible how much better NBA coaches behave than their high school and college counterparts, partially because NBA officials are not scared to TCOB when warranted.

I have almost no problems at all with college coaches. And the times college coaches do get T'd, they are never a problem the rest of the game.

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by Raymond

I have almost no problems at all with college coaches. And the times college coaches do get T'd, they are never a problem the rest of the game.

That's great for you, but I was speaking as a whole. NBA coaches collectively get away with far less than high school and college coaches.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by SC Official

That's great for you, but I was speaking as a whole. NBA coaches collectively get away with far less than high school and college coaches.

My experiences are representative of the whole. College coaches conduct themselves so much better than High School coaches is not even a comparison. It is two different planes.

College coaches have to answer to both the coordinator of officials for the conference and the conference commissioner. You don't see any more Bobby Knight's out there.

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[Kelvin green]

I think that in many cases the NBA rule on Ts for coaches makes it easier to call a T.....when then the penalty is one shot ( and no possession), an official will be more likely to call it..... think about what a T is... it is a Technical Violation of the Rules... in the NBA it’s one shot... (most likely a donation to NBA charities) and hey coach, you got my attention and you’re half way out the door. But this doesn’t change the complexion of the game...

Too many officials at NFHS level are worried that a T is two shots and the ball.. which could result in a 4 or 5 point play and a big swing in momentum..we shouldn’t worry about this but too many do...

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Kelvin green

Too many officials at NFHS level are worried that a T is two shots and the ball.. which could result in a 4 or 5 point play and a big swing in momentum..we shouldn’t worry about this but too many do...

You really think officials are worried about two shots that much? I think the issue is that there are no other penalties associated with a T, wherein the NBA there actually is penalties for accumulated Ts. It is usually the fall out I think that is the issue more than giving a T. We do not get supported many times in high school. In the NBA it is hard to dispute an official giving a T when we see him going nuts. Coaches at the high school level say all kinds of things and if you give them a T, they will claim you did something wrong to them.

Peace

[pfan1981]

Originally Posted by Kelvin green

Too many officials at NFHS level are worried that a T is two shots and the ball.. which could result in a 4 or 5 point play and a big swing in momentum..we shouldn’t worry about this but too many do...

Had an undefeated ranked team last night. Player drives gets fouled, easy call since the defender moved towards an airborne shooter with significant contact, ball was definitely affected and did not go in, call the foul, offender yells at me and throws their arms around. Technical foul.

Player made both shooting fouls with the lanes cleared, made both technical foul free throws, their team got the ball at half court. That team ended up losing by three.

Slept like a baby. I have no problem if a player or coach crosses the line and violates a rule in the rulebook. A technical foul is just another foul and that’s why it’s in rule 10. Take care of your business and help the next crew.

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by Raymond

My experiences are representative of the whole. College coaches conduct themselves so much better than High School coaches is not even a comparison. It is two different planes.

College coaches have to answer to both the coordinator of officials for the conference and the conference commissioner. You don't see any more Bobby Knight's out there.

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Coaches answer to the coordinator? That's news to me. Normally it's the other way around.

And NBA coaches are still better behaved collectively than college coaches.

[SC Official]

There are plenty of assigners, camp clinicians, officials, coaches, administrators, etc. who assume you are in the wrong someway, somehow whenever you issue a T, e.g. it must have been the result of bad game management. We are the bad guys for taking care of business. No, this is not the case most of the time, but it does happen. And that is one of the reasons officials may be reluctant to whack.

Instead of asking "what could we have done differently?" or "did it fit?" every time a T is issued, maybe just admit that the coach's reaction was disproportionate with the actual or perceived slight.

[JRutledge]

There are rarely things that I would call an "automatic" T. For one if you are different places, there are different cultures of behavior, which means you have to handle those situations differently. And if that is the only outburst, then I might not even have to give a warning if that is all the coach did. Again the goal is not to call Ts if you can because just like stated if it does not make the game better, then you might have interjected tension into the game that would not normally be there. The Ts I gave even 5 years ago is very different than the Ts I give now.

I had a game last night with two very demonstrative coaches. If we had given a T for every time they waved their arms or clapped or ranted about something, we would have given multiple Ts. We as a crew choose to handle the situation and we did not need to give a T at any point in the game. Lesser experienced officials would have had Ts a probably an ejection. Also, no warning was given during the night. Not everything can be said to be "automatic."

Peace