Dead Ball?

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Rufus

Absolutely. At first I was going to let it go but a light bulb went off when I thought "that hit the batter, it's a dead ball." I asked for time to discuss it with the PU. The PU said that it was still a live ball even though it had hit the batter. The BU came in and backed him up on it as well (both that the batter was hit by the ball and that it was still live).

Sounds like at least a friendly conversation with the UIC is in order. Even the most green umpire should know the ball is dead here. Might not know what to do about it on a strike ... but SURELY should know it's dead.

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

Sounds like at least a friendly conversation with the UIC is in order. Even the most green umpire should know the ball is dead here. Might not know what to do about it on a strike ... but SURELY should know it's dead.

I actually know the assignor for this association and I discussed with him that day and he confirmed the BU's ruling. Based on my research and this thread he and I had a discussion this afternoon that was very cordial. I wasn't looking to score points or "win" an argument, but wanted to be sure there was an understanding of the rule and see if he had a different interpretation (he and I go back a few years and he has always been approachable which is why I felt comfortable handling this way).

I made sure to let him know that one call didn't win/lose the game for us (us not scoring enough and allowing too many runs took care of that) and emphasized that I call basketball, am always looking to get rules correct, and will do research to ensure I get the correct answer. He was appreciative and said he'd be sure to let his guys know for future reference.

[jicecone]

So the PU didn't know.

The BU didn't know.

Their assignor didn't know.

Coach, you have a long season ahead of you.

[MD Longhorn]

I can't overestimate how sad it makes me that someone has risen to the UIC level and doesn't know this simple principle. Really makes you wonder what other things he doesn't know and should. This is REALLY basic stuff.

[kylejt]

Honestly, someone needs to put a tent on that circus.

What type of ball is this? Little League? PONY? HS? Someone in a position of authority is giving out some bum information. I wonder what other type of nonsense is being dispensed.

Edit: You said FED, but maybe it's little kids, with rookie umpires, playing HS rules. If this is HS, then the kids are really being shortchanged by idiots. These fellows are making good money. They should know the basics. Why rookies are allowed to do ANY sort of HS ball is beyond me. Start in LL, and work your way up. Some of the worst umpires I've ever seen are working at the HS level, and there's no reason for it. You should, IMO, have at least two years on the diamond before you work a HS game. The kids deserve it.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by kylejt

Why rookies are allowed to do ANY sort of HS ball is beyond me. Start in LL, and work your way up. Some of the worst umpires I've ever seen are working at the HS level, and there's no reason for it. You should, IMO, have at least two years on the diamond before you work a HS game. The kids deserve it.

Actually, it seems to me that (assuming the umpire knows the rules and has proven it via test!) it's actually easier to umpire a high school game than an 8U game. You can know 80% of the rules and have nothing happen in a high school season that you can't handle. Yeah, you may miss one here and there, but for the most part, you'll be ok. (At the same time, generally you want your rookies working with a veteran for a while).

However, at 8U or 10U - those 20% of the rules that you don't know will ALL pop up, all in your very first game.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

A couple of years ago, I was the PU for a boys' 13U Travel League game. Same batter two At-Bats in a row: With two strikes on him he swings and misses on a pitch that comes up and in on him striking him in the chest. Two strike outs for the batter. The first time his coach gave a half-hearted protest but gave up when I wouldn't buy his argument that the swinging of the batter doesn't count.

MTD, Sr.

[kylejt]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

Actually, it seems to me that (assuming the umpire knows the rules and has proven it via test!) it's actually easier to umpire a high school game than an 8U game. You can know 80% of the rules and have nothing happen in a high school season that you can't handle. Yeah, you may miss one here and there, but for the most part, you'll be ok. (At the same time, generally you want your rookies working with a veteran for a while).

However, at 8U or 10U - those 20% of the rules that you don't know will ALL pop up, all in your very first game.

Granted, but that's where you learn all those crazy rules, and see all the nutty stuff so the upper division games are a breeze.

Example: I helped out the local and did a 8-9 year old playoff game last night. One runner got obstructed at second and third, then got thrown out at the plate by ten feet. So I added up the those two, called time, and awarded him home. Can you imagine all the question marks over everyone's head? Luckily, nobody questions my calls at the little guy park. "He knows what he's doing out there", I heard from behind the backstop.

The next game was 9-11. More goofy plays. IFF yes/no on several balls. High enough? Any gonna catch it? Lots of judgement calls in 2 hours o' fun. More plays at the plate than a month of Senior league games.

Cut your teeth on the little guys first, before you hit the big field.

[yawetag]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

I can't overestimate how sad it makes me that someone has risen to the UIC level and doesn't know this simple principle. Really makes you wonder what other things he doesn't know and should. This is REALLY basic stuff.

The UIC I worked with wasn't that skilled in rules, either. It doesn't surprise me of OP's situation, and it also makes me sad.