I was told last night...

[harmbu]

by the umpires that a left-handed pitcher can bring his foot behind the rubber and still throw to first as long as his knee doesn't cross. I can't find anything about the knee in the rule book (FED). Any help?

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by harmbu

by the umpires that a left-handed pitcher can bring his foot behind the rubber and still throw to first as long as his knee doesn't cross. I can't find anything about the knee in the rule book (FED). Any help?

FED 6-2-4(f)

(acts by a pitcher that constitute a balk if there is a runner or runners on base)

"failing to pitch to the batter when the enitre non-pivot foot passes behind the perpendicular plane of the back edge of the pitcher's plate, except when throwing or feinting to second base....."

[UmpJM]

harmbu,

You were told wrong. In FED, if the free foot entirely passes the back plane of the rubber, the LH F1 may no longer go to first or it's a balk. 6-2-4f.

JM

[harmbu]

Garth,

That is the exact rule that I showed them. One of them told me that it was somewhere in there about the knee. I knew he was wrong, but how do you prove it to someone who believes that it is there and that you just have to keep looking? It had nothing to do with the outcome of the game, so I did not pursue it any further. I knew I could come here and find out what I wanted to know.

Thanks

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by harmbu

Garth,

That is the exact rule that I showed them. One of them told me that it was somewhere in there about the knee. I knew he was wrong, but how do you prove it to someone who believes that it is there and that you just have to keep looking? It had nothing to do with the outcome of the game, so I did not pursue it any further. I knew I could come here and find out what I wanted to know.

Thanks

It is a waste of time, and hazardous to your ability to remain in the game, to reason with umpires who do not take the time to know the rules.Contact the assignor, and ask him for an opinion without accusing the umpires of being as stupid as they appear to be.

[LMan]

Originally Posted by harmbu

That is the exact rule that I showed them....... but how do you prove it to someone who believes that it is there and that you just have to keep looking?

You've already proven it. Until they produce countering evidence, you win.
"It's in there somewhere" doesn't fly.

[nickrego]

Originally Posted by harmbu

Garth,

That is the exact rule that I showed them. One of them told me that it was somewhere in there about the knee. I knew he was wrong, but how do you prove it to someone who believes that it is there and that you just have to keep looking? It had nothing to do with the outcome of the game, so I did not pursue it any further. I knew I could come here and find out what I wanted to know.

Thanks

If you're in a good mood, you tell the coach he has 1 minute to find it in "HIS" rule book. Otherwise, we play based on my knowledge and interpretation of the rules. Protest if you like (said with a smile).

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by nickrego

If you're in a good mood, you tell the coach he has 1 minute to find it in "HIS" rule book. Otherwise, we play based on my knowledge and interpretation of the rules. Protest if you like (said with a smile).

Helmet on too tight, Nick? You've got the roles reversed here.

[harmbu]

Originally Posted by nickrego

If you're in a good mood, you tell the coach he has 1 minute to find it in "HIS" rule book. Otherwise, we play based on my knowledge and interpretation of the rules. Protest if you like (said with a smile).

I sure hope you are joking. The problem is I have encountered umpires before with that attitude. What do you do when you have an umpire who comes up with something that is way off and nowhere to be found in the rulebook.

I have no recourse but to call the assignor after the game when it is too late.

[mcrowder]

Originally Posted by harmbu

I sure hope you are joking. The problem is I have encountered umpires before with that attitude. What do you do when you have an umpire who comes up with something that is way off and nowhere to be found in the rulebook.

I have no recourse but to call the assignor after the game when it is too late.

You seem to know your book. Except for the part that's important now... Read up on protests - and use it.

[LMan]

Originally Posted by harmbu

I sure hope you are joking. The problem is I have encountered umpires before with that attitude. What do you do when you have an umpire who comes up with something that is way off and nowhere to be found in the rulebook.

I have no recourse but to call the assignor after the game when it is too late.

After you offered your POV and he rejects it, isn't this between him and the coach(es)? He's tossing himself under the bus here.

What else do you want to do about it during the game? Shout about it? Wrestle him like SDS wants to do whenever a partner shows up in white gloves after Labor Day?

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by LMan

After you offered your POV and he rejects it, isn't this between him and the coach(es)? He's tossing himself under the bus here.

What else do you want to do about it during the game? Shout about it? Wrestle him like SDS wants to do whenever a partner shows up in white gloves after Labor Day?

Does nobody get that the original poster is the coach and he's talking about ignorant umpires, not his parnter and not other coaches?

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by LMan

Wrestle him like SDS wants to do whenever a partner shows up in white gloves after Labor Day?

Are you lookin' for a fight, buddy?

[nickrego]

Originally Posted by harmbu

I sure hope you are joking. The problem is I have encountered umpires before with that attitude. What do you do when you have an umpire who comes up with something that is way off and nowhere to be found in the rulebook.

I have no recourse but to call the assignor after the game when it is too late.

Here's the deal...

We don't carry rule books, we are supposed to know the rules. Now, most of us are not professional umpires, so we do make mistakes. And that includes interpretation of the rules. So, when a coach questions our application of a rule, if I think it is appropriate, I will give the coach the opportunity to prove me wrong, based on showing me the rule, in the rule book.

He can argue his rule knowledge against mine all day long, but he is not going to change my mind, or waste game time doing it. If all we have is two opinions, the umpire's must win out.

For the record, I only give the coach the opportunity if I am not sure about the situation. And that is only for those rare occasions when something obscure, that happens once in a career so your not really up on it, is the issue.

And don't ask me for an example. I can't tell you about a rule I don't know about. Why, because if I don't know about it, how can I know about it ?

[jkumpire]

Men,

Frankly, we all know that most of us have people in our area who do not take the game as seriously as we do. For some people, I would recommend carrying a book with them, or as the FED Umpire manual says, to have one easily available.

For most of us, we would never tolerate someone bringing out the book to try and correct us, it may well be an ejectable offense. But I woulkd rather have somebody get the call right by having a rule book with them to refer to than messing things up.

Of course, having said that we need to also admit that coaches should never carry a rule book with them to a game, live hand grenades in the dugout can always blow a coaches hand off or worse, get him ejected.....