Recent Game - 1st Ejection of the year

[PeteBooth]

I posted and will continue to post real situations so that others and myself can learn from them. Unless you have any objections.

I do not care what you post and you can post to your "hearts content" but here is one of your responses to a poster

Again, I will happily answer any questions you have and engage in any discussion you would like to on the topic of handling situations.

In that entire thread it sounded to me as if you were defending yourself.

The ending of your original post was with a question which IMO was answered, yet you didn't like the answer and felt the need to give a disertation on your umpiring career to substantiate what you did.

As far as your comment about ejecting assistant coaches. If you ignore them there's no need to eject.

IMO, engaging with an assitant coach is like engaging with the scorekeeper.

Again as I stated in my original post to you, the theme of the thread is "why did you feel the need to engage with the assistants." Perhaps you knew them

Pete Booth

[SanDiegoSteve]

I'm still trying to get past "rum dum high school or adult ball."

***

[Durham]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

I'm still trying to get past "rum dum high school or adult ball."

Steve,

High school and adult ball ejections happen ever day without being reported, that was my point and you are correct I should have stated it in a better way.

[Durham]

Ok Pete,

I don't know too many people that would take a side and not defend it, but I am willing to learn so teach me because I want to know how to do it better.

"In the top of the 2nd, the third out was made on a non-routine play at first base where the first baseman possibly had his foot off the base. My partner called the runner out and the entire dugout erupted."

Why don't you explain to me how you handle it from there and why you handle it that way.

[gobama84]

Originally Posted by Durham

Ok Pete,

"In the top of the 2nd, the third out was made on a non-routine play at first base where the first baseman possibly had his foot off the base. My partner called the runner out and the entire dugout erupted."

Why don't you explain to me how you handle it from there and why you handle it that way.

Let me jump in here.
I would ignore it, it wasn't my call.

[Durham]

Originally Posted by gobama84

Let me jump in here.
I would ignore it, it wasn't my call.

Ok, you would ignore it, because it was not your call. How about the rest of you? What would you do?

[SanDiegoSteve]

I would let the BU handle it because it was his call. I would walk calmly in that direction, and if the BU had more than he could handle, then I would get involved, but not before.

[PeteBooth]

Originally Posted by Durham

Ok Pete,

"In the top of the 2nd, the third out was made on a non-routine play at first base where the first baseman possibly had his foot off the base. My partner called the runner out and the entire dugout erupted."

Why don't you explain to me how you handle it from there and why you handle it that way.

I am very surprised with all your experience that you would ask this type of question. The call belonged to the BU, therefore, I would give my partner the respect he/she deserves and let them handle it. There is no need for me to get involved.

If the BU wants any help or assistance from me he/she will ask.

I think you are "pulling our legs" now because most of us learned to not intervene with our partners call unless asked to do so in Umpiring 101.

Pete Booth

[Durham]

Originally Posted by PeteBooth

I am very surprised with all your experience that you would ask this type of question. The call belonged to the BU, therefore, I would give my partner the respect he/she deserves and let them handle it. There is no need for me to get involved.

If the BU wants any help or assistance from me he/she will ask.

I think you are "pulling our legs" now because most of us learned to not intervene with our partners call unless asked to do so in Umpiring 101.

Pete Booth

First off Pete, my experience has taught me that I don't know everything and to open my mind to learning about other ideas, even ones I do not agree with. Maybe I don't agree with them simply don't understand them.

Second, I was there that day in umpiring 101 and I did learn that, but the funny thing is, if you keep going to class thru the 200's and 300's they have you unlearn some of the things they first taught you and teach you different things: like you are partners and here is the rule book and these are the guidelines and at the end of the day you have to make sure they are done as a team, and not you take this half and I take my half and let's go work.

Examples:
Number of on deck hitters, I know there should only be 2 on deck hitters in NCAA and I see 4 guys out there swing the bat. The crew is responsible for enforcing that, but many guys think, I can't say anything about that it is the PU's job.
Last year, a player drew a line on a called third on my partner and he didn't see it, I turned to the HC who was at the end of the 3rd base dugout next to me and I asked him to take care of it and he pulled the player from the game. Did I step on toes there or help the crew?
A friend of mine, AAA umpire is working a game a few weeks ago, and his partner makes a call that one team doesn't like and the HC of that team throws his hat onto the field and the BU doesn't see it, so my friend runs him. Did he step on toes or help the crew?
A guy in the dugout snipers your partner on balls and strikes and you see exactly who did it. Why not help your partner?
The right fielder yells at your partner on balls and strikes. Why not turn and let him know you heard him and that you don't want to hear it again?
You’re at the 45-foot line on a play at first and the 1st base dugout pops off at your partner after he has had several close calls. Why not help out by deflecting for him?

I have learned that it is better for the crew to umpire the situation and not stick to it's his call and he has to take every ounce of crap for it. If the teams know that I am watching your back and you are watching mine and they have to deal with the 2 or 3 of us, it makes our job easier. Why would I disrespect my partner by letting him go it alone if I could help him, and the crew?

[mcrowder]

"... I am willing to learn..."

"... I am willing to open my mind and listen to other suggestions..."

Uh, no you're not. Much the opposite in fact. It's clear to 90% of the real umpires here that you "warned" too much, WAY to much in my opinion. Feel free to be in the minority here, but don't denigrate EVERYONE for disagreeing with you, especially since you specifically requested input and profess to be open to learning.

PS - I've worked in many states, and ALL of them require write-ups in short order for ANY ejections. This is not the first time you've stated erroneous assumptions about high school officiating. Did you EVER work high-school ball? Or were you born an NCAA umpire one day, right from the umpiring womb?

PPS - it's the kiss of death to get PWL on your side. That should tell you right there that you've strayed way off base and are subject to an appeal.

[Az.Ump]

Originally Posted by Durham

Steve,

High school and adult ball ejections happen ever day without being reported, that was my point and you are correct I should have stated it in a better way.

That’s certainly not how it’s done here. All ejections including coaches, assistant coaches and players must be reported in full with in 24 hours.

Paul B.

[Durham]

Paul, that may be the case where you are from; and I am not saying that it happens every day all, the time, but we have all heard stories about someone getting ejected and no report was ever turned in. It is not like I am saying that you have to believe in a rising fastball, because I am not, but are you telling me that every high school and adult ball ejection in the country gets reported?

[Az.Ump]

Originally Posted by Durham

Paul, that may be the case where you are from; and I am not saying that it happens every day all, the time, but we have all heard stories about someone getting ejected and no report was ever turned in. It is not like I am saying that you have to believe in a rising fastball, because I am not, but are you telling me that every high school and adult ball ejection in the country gets reported?

No,

It just came off as a slight toward HS umpires. Here the AIA takes ejections quite seriously.

Paul B.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Durham

Paul, that may be the case where you are from; and I am not saying that it happens every day all, the time, but we have all heard stories about someone getting ejected and no report was ever turned in. It is not like I am saying that you have to believe in a rising fastball, because I am not, but are you telling me that every high school and adult ball ejection in the country gets reported?

Around here, they do. I assign a 44-team adult league and the umpires are required to file ejection reports. There are usually 1-2 a week. And since all ejections in HS carry a 1-game suspension, umpires are expected to fill out an ejection report ASAP after an ejection occurs.

[Tim C]

In Oregon we are required to report all ejections within 24 hours. All ejections carry an additional one game suspension (appealable).

In high school baseball last year there were 96 ejections across all levels of high school baseball statewide. 41 of those ejections were for Malicious Contact.

Over 60% of the ejections occurred at the sub-varsity level. 9 forfeits were documented, all at the sub-varsity level, when teams did not have an ASEP certified coach to take over after a coach ejection.

Of the 96 ejections 41 were appealed for "special considerations". All appeals were tied to cutting the game suspension for the player/coach or to lower or eliminate the fine for the ejection.

20 appeals were granted by the Oregon School Activities Association. Neither of the player ejections that occurred during playoffs were successfully appealed.

Oregon is serious about reporting ejections.