Observations From First Games of the Season

[EsqUmp]

Originally Posted by RKBUmp

You may want to check your rule book.

FED 6-5-2 The pitcher may request the other ball before throwing a warm up pitch by giving the ball in her posession to the plate umpire, the pitcher has now made a choice and must pitch that ball until such time as the ball goes out of play or becomes blocked.

That addresses two different issues at two different times.

"The pitcher may request the other ball before throwing a warm up pitch." That addresses the start of the inning.

"The pitcher must pitch that ball until such time as the ball goes out of play." That does not say that she can't continue to pitch the ball AFTER it goes out of play. It just says she has to use it UNTIL it goes out of play.

Have you every asked a pitcher why she wants a new ball? Maybe the one you have has a nick in it you didn't see, she can't grip it as well or a ball got returned to you that looked like the game ball but really wasn't.

I want pitchers to throw strikes, so I give the pitcher a ball that she is comfortable with. It's not a protestable issue. It's really just a mechanic/procedure. I think we have bigger fish to fry than that.

[RKBUmp]

Originally Posted by EsqUmp

That addresses two different issues at two different times.

"The pitcher may request the other ball before throwing a warm up pitch." That addresses the start of the inning.

"The pitcher must pitch that ball until such time as the ball goes out of play." That does not say that she can't continue to pitch the ball AFTER it goes out of play. It just says she has to use it UNTIL it goes out of play.

Have you every asked a pitcher why she wants a new ball? Maybe the one you have has a nick in it you didn't see, she can't grip it as well or a ball got returned to you that looked like the game ball but really wasn't.

I want pitchers to throw strikes, so I give the pitcher a ball that she is comfortable with. It's not a protestable issue. It's really just a mechanic/procedure. I think we have bigger fish to fry than that.

So you are choosing to ignore a rule then? If the ball is truly unplayable, the pitcher can throw it in for you to inspect, and then yes you remove it from play and replace it. If after throwing a pitch, the pitcher just decides she wants another ball for no reason and you give it to her, you are violating the ball rotation rule. And any ball that goes out of play is not suppose to be put back into play until it has been inspected by the umpire. How do you know somone hasnt snuck in a ball that isnt legal? Wouldnt be the first time I have heard about mush balls being thrown back into a game.

[EsqUmp]

Originally Posted by RKBUmp

So you are choosing to ignore a rule then? If the ball is truly unplayable, the pitcher can throw it in for you to inspect, and then yes you remove it from play and replace it. If after throwing a pitch, the pitcher just decides she wants another ball for no reason and you give it to her, you are violating the ball rotation rule. And any ball that goes out of play is not suppose to be put back into play until it has been inspected by the umpire. How do you know somone hasnt snuck in a ball that isnt legal? Wouldnt be the first time I have heard about mush balls being thrown back into a game.

I'm not ignoring a rule. You are misapplying the "rule" in Federation and it isn't a rule in ASA. It is a procedure covered under the R/S.

What is the problem with getting the ball back from the pitcher, tossing out a new one and rubbing the old one up a bit and putting it back in the ball bag? And if Federation and ASA are so big on ball rotation, why doesn't it say that the umpire must inspect every ball that goes out of play? If the ball rolls an inch over the dead ball line, will you not allow that ball back in? If the ball hits equipment and becomes blocked, are you switching that ball? If the defender intentionally or unintentionally carries a ball out of play, are you changing that ball too?

[Manny A]

Not only do I inspect all balls that go out of play (I mean way out of play, not those that barely enter a dugout and are immediately retrieved, etc.), I also inspect balls that are sharply fouled off of backstop fencing and dugouts. In fact, I inspect balls that smack off the catcher's mask, but that's really to give the catcher time to recover.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Manny A

Not only do I inspect all balls that go out of play (I mean way out of play, not those that barely enter a dugout and are immediately retrieved, etc.), I also inspect balls that are sharply fouled off of backstop fencing and dugouts. In fact, I inspect balls that smack off the catcher's mask, but that's really to give the catcher time to recover.

Any ball which leaves the umpire's sight should come back into play through the umpire's hands.

If a ball goes out of play, the ball in my bag is often in the catcher's hands before the batted ball stops rolling. Do not wait for a ball to come back. If it gets thrown back onto the field, I ask for that ball before it gets to the pitcher.

And unless it is the only ball available, if it goes out of play, it does not immediately return to play. Why? Basically, because it is the prescribed procedure and if consistent, the fairest manner in which the umpire can maintain order in the game.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by EsqUmp

"The pitcher must pitch that ball until such time as the ball goes out of play." That does not say that she can't continue to pitch the ball AFTER it goes out of play. It just says she has to use it UNTIL it goes out of play.

What do you think "out of play" means?

[RKBUmp]

I knew we had been over this before, and not all that long ago either.

Ball Rotation

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

What do you think "out of play" means?

Good question, what do YOU think it means? Does it only mean (to you) left the park and gone forever, never to be seen again?

Given that we're discussing FED and ASA rules, most of us expect to get that ball back at some point ... sometimes immediately.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Good question, what do YOU think it means? Does it only mean (to you) left the park and gone forever, never to be seen again?

Given that we're discussing FED and ASA rules, most of us expect to get that ball back at some point ... sometimes immediately.

I was just making the point, by facetious question to one poster, that out of play means not being used.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

out of play means not being used.

I guess I missed your facetiousness, given that out of play actually means out of play - not being used means not being used.

[Manny A]

I find this whole ball rotation discussion fascinating. I wonder what's the history behind it?

If a pitcher doesn't like the "feel" of the hole in front of the pitcher's plate, and asks for Time to have it fixed, aren't you going to take the time to help her out, perhaps even bringing the grounds crew in to do some repair work? But if that pitcher throws 7-8 balls in a row out of the strikezone, and she wants another ball, why the heck does ASA and FED tell me I can't give it to her?

[EsqUmp]

Originally Posted by Manny A

I find this whole ball rotation discussion fascinating. I wonder what's the history behind it?

If a pitcher doesn't like the "feel" of the hole in front of the pitcher's plate, and asks for Time to have it fixed, aren't you going to take the time to help her out, perhaps even bringing the grounds crew in to do some repair work? But if that pitcher throws 7-8 balls in a row out of the strikezone, and she wants another ball, why the heck does ASA and FED tell me I can't give it to her?

I'm sure I'll be accused of not actually being at the table in the 1930s when the book was first written, but common sense says that it was implemented to prevent the pitcher from constantly asking for a new ball for the purpose of delaying the game. It also ensured that teams weren't throwing in "dead" balls while keeping the more juiced ones in the dugout. The issue with getting the new ball in in the bottom half of the second is just to make sure a new ball doesn't first enter the game in the 7th inning.

Abiding by strict ball rotation is ridiculous. Those who tend to do it don't properly interpret the rule, as is evident by others' posts. There is no remedy for not abiding by it. It isn't something that could be protested. Even if someone was dumb enough to protest it and someone else even dumber to uphold the protest, there is no remedy. What are you going to do, go back to the point of the protest and resume play from there with....hmmm....which ball do we use now....?