let's make up rules!!!!!

[anpump]

There are a couple of ways to approach this for LL:

1. In pre-game, the question is asked to the managers, are your players properly equiped and prepared to play today's game?

2. Clearly state there is no jewelry allowed other than for medical or religious reasons. Don't issue a warning but they should know they'll get a stern reminder if anyone is caught.

3. After the first offense play shall be suspended, the offending player shall remove the item and assuming it's done in 2 minutes or less (help from a manager to cut something off or whatever) the game moves on with no further penalty. Team warning is issued however.

4. Eject any subsequent offenders.

Minors to big league, there should be no questions about this.

[Dakota]

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA
And, yes, I have heard umpires offer these types of warnings about numerous rules from throwing a bat, language, helmet-removal, jewelry to discussing a play.

I have too. I agree with Cecil - they make the umpire appear lazy and sets the game off on a confrontational tone.

Originally posted by CecilOne
It might be technically permissible, but calling strikes for delay in situations like this is outside the purpose and spirit of the delay rule and we are supposed to understand that.

Agree completely.

Originally posted by anpump
There are a couple of ways to approach this for LL:

1. In pre-game, the question is asked to the managers, are your players properly equiped and prepared to play today's game?

2. Clearly state there is no jewelry allowed other than for medical or religious reasons. Don't issue a warning but they should know they'll get a stern reminder if anyone is caught.

3. After the first offense play shall be suspended, the offending player shall remove the item and assuming it's done in 2 minutes or less (help from a manager to cut something off or whatever) the game moves on with no further penalty. Team warning is issued however.

4. Eject any subsequent offenders.

Minors to big league, there should be no questions about this.

An excellent way to handle it. In a typical rec league 70 minute timed game, two minutes is pushing it, though.

[CecilOne]

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA
... snip ... Rule 3.6.F gives the umpire the discretion for determining what is dangerous jewelry which allows for the direction to remove whatever the piece may be.

However, the other three are going to be hard to enforce because two insist on the batter being directed by the umpire to the box when in fact, the umpire just directed them out away from the box. The third is only in effect AFTER the batter has entered the box and the umpire has forbidden that to happen. Actually, the only "official" remedy an ASA umpire has is found in 5.4 (forfeit) and I believe that may be a bit extreme in the beginning. ... snip ... Mike

I believe the above is the reality of the strike calling issue and negates the possibility, at least for ASA and NFHS.

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA
... snip ... tell them, "Coach, your team was instructed that no jewelry will be permitted. Have this jewelry removed from this young lady or give me a subsitute. Mike

I have always been taught that we should just say the player "can not play with jewelry" rather than "Have this jewelry removed"; because that is the rule and we are not authorized to tell anyone what they can wear when not playing. There is also some possibility of "injury" while removing the item, and we don't want to start any more nonsense lawsuits.

[chris s]

Originally posted by Dakota

OK which is it? A BS call or making up rules? It is, as I explained, not how I would handle it, and a bit hard nosed. I call a lot of 12U rec ball, similar players and atmosphere, I imagine, to LL. I would not even consider jumping right to calling strikes in a case like this.

If, as I speculated above, the umpire was attempting to prevent delay / problems after having seen girls warm up wearing jewlery, then his annoyance is understandable. If both teams were reminded of the jewelry rule, but one chose to ignore the reminder, well, who is to blame for even having the girl enter the box still wearing jewelry?

Making this call in this situation, it seems to me, would cause more rukus than it would help the game move along - after all, the purpose of the no jewelry rule is safety, and the purpose of the 10 sec rule is stopping delay. Going right to the penalty in this situation is not good game management, IMO. None of that, however, means he was making up rules.

Baseball is a different game with different traditions regarding delay and different rules.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~
Tom, I indeed thought at the time he was making this up. Second year official, my kids been playing ball 5 years now. never seen, nor heard this before.Guess I could do this in baseball.F3 the other nite as I am in "A" position got a necklace on, I simply call time, have him remove it, puit in my pocket and return it after 3 outs. Simple, HUH?? WAIT, maybe I as the BU should award a ball to the batter???

[Dakota]

Originally posted by chris s
WAIT, maybe I as the BU should award a ball to the batter???

LOL! Now THAT would be making up rules!

[mick]

Originally posted by anpump
There are a couple of ways to approach this for LL:

1. In pre-game, the question is asked to the managers, are your players properly equiped and prepared to play today's game?

anpump,
We don't usually allow managers during our pre-game.
mick

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by CecilOne
Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA
... snip ... tell them, "Coach, your team was instructed that no jewelry will be permitted. Have this jewelry removed from this young lady or give me a subsitute. Mike

I have always been taught that we should just say the player "can not play with jewelry" rather than "Have this jewelry removed"; because that is the rule and we are not authorized to tell anyone what they can wear when not playing. There is also some possibility of "injury" while removing the item, and we don't want to start any more nonsense lawsuits. [/QUOTE]

Semantically, you are probably correct. I guess I have encountered too many...ah...er...let's say folks who have stood there and waited for me to TELL them their options after noting that the player could not participate with jewelry on. However, I do not see the litigeous side as I offered the coach an option to removing the jewelry

[mick]

Had a catcher in front of me for a coupla innings and when she came up to bat (sans catcher's helmet) I saw 6 ear studs in her left ear.

"Time!"

Went to the bench and never played again because it was too much of a hassle to remove them.
mick

[chris s]

Originally posted by Dakota

LOL! Now THAT would be making up rules!

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!
Glad you took that the way it was meant! Cheers buddy and very much thanks for the info!

[Dakota]

While we're on the topic, have had this happen a couple of times... Player shows up with tape covering her ear lobe, probably because there are earings under there. I let it go, since I didn't see any jewelry and I'm not going to ask a player to remove a bandage.

OTOH, if a player has earings and asks if she can just tape it over, the answer is no - since I've seen it, I know there is no injury, just a coverup. The earings have to be removed.

Is this the correct way to handle this?

[mick]

Originally posted by Dakota
While we're on the topic, have had this happen a couple of times... Player shows up with tape covering her ear lobe, probably because there are earings under there. I let it go, since I didn't see any jewelry and I'm not going to ask a player to remove a bandage.

OTOH, if a player has earings and asks if she can just tape it over, the answer is no - since I've seen it, I know there is no injury, just a coverup. The earings have to be removed.

Is this the correct way to handle this?

Tom,
Three years ago, my ref/ump life became much simpler when I went with the 'zero tolerance' policy where the jewelry rules were clear.
I do ask, "What's under the tape?"

If any pretty ear gets disfigured because we allowed tape, we will not necessarily be forgiven for not attending to the rules.
mick

---

OK, so what's the speed of dark?

[whiskers_ump]

When coaches verify to the umpire-in-chief that their players are
equipped in accordance with the rules, this shall also pertain to
jewerly, but does not constitute a team warning.

Case book 1.19 Sit. A.

glen

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by mick

Tom,
Three years ago, my ref/ump life became much simpler when I went with the 'zero tolerance' policy where the jewelry rules were clear.
I do ask, "What's under the tape?"

If any pretty ear gets disfigured because we allowed tape, we will not necessarily be forgiven for not attending to the rules.
mick

---

Not to be a smart-***, Mick, but it is really none of your business what is under the tape. Do you ask the players to open their mouth to check their tongue? Lift their shirt to check their navel or breast? Drop their....nevermind, you get the point.

Speaking ASA

The rule specifically states the jewelry must be exposed. It also states that only that jewelry which YOU deem dangerous must be removed.

With all due respect to those who live their lives in such a manner, on the ball field, I am not my brother's keeper. My concern lies with articles dangerous to others, not the ball player wearing them. If they are foolish enough to risk their own well-being, so be it. If a juvenille, shame on their parents/guardians and/or coaches.

I know some of you may believe this as heresy, but I'm quite comfortable with my stance.

[mick]

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA

Not to be a smart-***, Mick, but it is really none of your business what is under the tape. Do you ask the players to open their mouth to check their tongue? Lift their shirt to check their navel or breast? Drop their....nevermind, you get the point.

Mike,
I don't look for anything. Tape covering jewelry is illegal. I see it. I call it.
When dealing with some of the teenage levels where jewelry is taboo, quite often the coaches have already told their players to "Remove it", but they leave the dirty work up to the ref/ump.
mick

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by mick

Mike,
I don't look for anything. Tape covering jewelry is illegal. I see it. I call it.
When dealing with some of the teenage levels where jewelry is taboo, quite often the coaches have already told their players to "Remove it", but they leave the dirty work up to the ref/ump.
mick

Mick,

If something is covered by anything, it is not exposed. Therefore, not subject to your inspection.

I understand what you are saying and I can appreciate your efforts to protect players from themselves.

However, you need to appreciate that I don't consider self-inflicted damage done by one's jewelry a priority. I have my own kids to worry about, I don't need to assume guardianship of another 30 at game time. That is why they have parents and a coaching staff. Ball, strike, illegal, fair, foul, safe and out, plus the 114 pages of rules are my priority during a game.