Had to forfeit my 1st game

[ronald]

Originally Posted by Dakota

Declaring time expired would not end the game since home was at bat.

Thanks.

[vcblue]

I don't agree with the way this was handled. This was pure and simply a coach hastens or delay the game. Tell the coach he can't do that and that if he insists you may forfeit the game. If he continues on sending out his team to D eject him for USC. Tell the AC the same thing (By this time the clock would have expired). If the AC does nothing then call over the TD and UIC (in Socal ASA only the TD can Forfeit a game) tell them what happened and let them decide. In either case the game is over (however, this should not matter to us). Most ASA Commissioners I know would not go for this crap by a coach and would most like forfeit the game.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by vcblue

I don't agree with the way this was handled. This was pure and simply a coach hastens or delay the game. Tell the coach he can't do that and that if he insists you may forfeit the game. If he continues on sending out his team to D eject him for USC. Tell the AC the same thing (By this time the clock would have expired). If the AC does nothing then call over the TD and UIC (in Socal ASA only the TD can Forfeit a game) tell them what happened and let them decide. In either case the game is over (however, this should not matter to us). Most ASA Commissioners I know would not go for this crap by a coach and would most like forfeit the game.

Wait, wait, wait... What?! Only the TD can forfeit a game?! That's horsespit.

Look, in 17 years, I've only forfeited games for only one reason: not having enough players. So I'm not "quick to the trigger." But I'll be damned if someone is going to take away a perfectly legitimate tool in my toolbag.

What on earth is their rationale?

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

...Only the TD can forfeit a game?...What on earth is their rationale?

It is not unusual to have this in the tournament rules; I'd guess the most common forfeit issue in tournaments is a team being late to the field. I'd guess the TD wants a say in forfeits for this reason.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Dholloway1962

Time expired first and I again told the coach to send the batter to the plate, which he didn't. He refused to continue to play so forfeit.

Coach violated rule 5 sections 4
C. Refused to continue to play
D. failed to resume play within 2 minutes after play ball declared
E. employed tactics noticeably desgined to delay or hasten the game
F. after warning by the umpire, willfully violated rules of the game

Those of you that say I pulled the trigger too quick, how long would you have waited? There was no signs of him putting the batter back, he was obviously grandstanding and trying to show me up, and just being a jacka..

I didn't say that you pulled the trigger too quick, just that I may not have done so as quickly. We all have different ways of handling this type of joker.

I may have tossed him, told the assistant to put the batter out there and moved on from there. Or I may have asked him straight on if he was refusing to continue play or follow the umpire's direction. That makes life real easy. I wouldn't have been hung up so much on the two-minute thing, but that you did is fine and well within the rules as set forth.

As previously noted, I have no problem with what you did and you have noted the same rules as I did earlier. I think you did your job just fine.

[reccer]

I can't speak for the forfeit part, but your initial reaction should have been to run the coach when you ascertained why his batter went to the dugout. Don't forget there is a DC who is playing by the rules and not trying to pencil whip the other team through baseless clock management shenanigans.

Although, I must admit, after hearing you call out strike 2 with time still on the clock, I will have a few chose words for you as well (or at least a pitching change in the very near future There is no way I am letting the game extend beyond that half inning after seeing what the other side is attempting to do.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by reccer

I can't speak for the forfeit part, but your initial reaction should have been to run the coach when you ascertained why his batter went to the dugout. Don't forget there is a DC who is playing by the rules and not trying to pencil whip the other team through baseless clock management shenanigans.

I'm not going to say what his reaction should have been. I will only say what it could have been. Again, I will reiterate: I have zero problem with how this was handled. The coach was given his options, and he made his choice. Yes, an ejection would've been justifiable, but in this sitch, there's more than one way to skin a cat.

Originally Posted by reccer

Although, I must admit, after hearing you call out strike 2 with time still on the clock, I will have a few chose words for you as well (or at least a pitching change in the very near future There is no way I am letting the game extend beyond that half inning after seeing what the other side is attempting to do.

I'm assuming you're speaking as the defensive coach? In that case, you'd be just as guilty as the home team coach for delaying/hastening a game.

"Don't worry, coach. I've got this one under control."

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by Dholloway1962

He was warned of the consequences and called my bluff. No WMD, he was the one who tried to use the WMD

Well if you warned him that you were giong to forfeit, then its 100% on him.

Thanks, your OP wasnt clear on that.

[Dholloway1962]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

I may have tossed him, told the assistant to put the batter out there and moved on from there. Or I may have asked him straight on if he was refusing to continue play or follow the umpire's direction. That makes life real easy. I wouldn't have been hung up so much on the two-minute thing, but that you did is fine and well within the rules as set forth.

I was really asking for other ways to have handled it, I really didn't want to forfeit the game but felt he gave me no choice. Thanks for the other ideas in case this happens again.

[vcblue]

I'm telling you ever ASA Chapisonship I have ever worked I always hear the same thing from the UIC. We do not forfiet the game. Treat it like a protest. Stop the clock and find the UIC and Commis. The umpire must explain to both why a forfiet is the way to go. They make the decission

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by vcblue

I'm telling you ever ASA Chapisonship I have ever worked I always hear the same thing from the UIC. We do not forfiet the game. Treat it like a protest. Stop the clock and find the UIC and Commis. The umpire must explain to both why a forfiet is the way to go. They make the decission

County-wide happy hour in Ventura tonight?

If you are working an ASA Championship game, you don't have a time limit or clock to stop.

Most UICs I know will simply walk up to the the coach and ask the same thing I suggested earlier, whether the coach is refusing to continue playing or not. Coach better come up with a pretty damn good response to be allowed to continue.

[vcblue]

I'm not saying they wouldn't support the decission. I am just saying the TD wants the power. ...and yes I did stop by cornies this evening

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by vcblue

I'm not saying they wouldn't support the decission. I am just saying the TD wants the power. ...and yes I did stop by cornies this evening

Well, here's the problem. Once the game starts, the TD doesn't have the power to determine anything which happens on the field.

[bkbjones]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

County-wide happy hour in Ventura tonight?

If you are working an ASA Championship game, you don't have a time limit or clock to stop.

Actually, you could...
For instance, in our regional code we do have a provision for timed games, in particular in loser's bracket games.

And if you lived in Ventura County, you'd drink too.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by bkbjones

Actually, you could...
For instance, in our regional code we do have a provision for timed games, in particular in loser's bracket games.

And if you lived in Ventura County, you'd drink too.

Again, if playing an ASA Championship GAME ........

Granted, he may have meant play or tournament, but I didn't have Johnny or Jack standing by to interpret.