Call at First

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally Posted by vcblue

Depends on where I rule she was obstructed. If the obstruction occurred AT first base, can you really call her out between first and second?

Just rule she tripped because of the obstruction, kill the play when she is tagged, put her at first base and everyone quit making giant circumlocular arguments.

Exactly. Obstruction is rarely an instantaneous moment in time or space; an obstructed runner is still obstructed until no longer impeded, and has regained any affect or result of attempting avoid the obstruction. In this case, as described, the BR was obstructed, and lost her balance as a result of the obstruction. It is, in my opinion, blatently wrong to even consider calling her out when the entire situation is clearly the result of the obstruction. What would it take to correct the result of this obstruction? Why, to NOT call her out.

This BR did exactly what the rulesmakers wish; instead of running over the obstructing F3, she made the effort to avoid the collision. In doing so, she lost her balance/footing/whatever, and tripped over the bag. She could have possibly fallen, then, in 4 directions; and it strikes me that some are arguing she is in jeopardy because of the direction in which she fell, when 3 of the 4 are clearly protected in ANY circumstance?

If you (not addressed to vcblue, the generic "you") can't figure out how she is protected on this play, you might want to reconsider why you are out there.

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

She could have possibly fallen, then, in 4 directions; and it strikes me that some are arguing she is in jeopardy because of the direction in which she fell, when 3 of the 4 are clearly protected in ANY circumstance?

If you (not addressed to vcblue, the generic "you") can't figure out how she is protected on this play, you might want to reconsider why you are out there.

Actually Steve.. I'm not so sure that all are protecting this runner no matter what way she fell... which is unfortunate.

Some based on the theory that she was obstructed before 1b
Some based on the theory falling over first is not over running it

[AtlUmpSteve]

Well, let's think about that. If obstructed before the base, and falls back toward home, then cannot be out by OBS rule. If falls forward toward right field, that HAS to be considered overrunning the base. If falls to the right, then (this may be the fallacy in my assumption about 3 sides), then SHOULD NOT be in jeopardy, since "turned" to the right.

So, the only side remaining is fell to the left.

[Badamk]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

If you (not addressed to vcblue, the generic "you") can't figure out how she is protected on this play, you might want to reconsider why you are out there.

You know who needs to reconsider being on the field? Guys like you who think they are the ultimate judge and better than everyone else. I dealt with umps like you when I was a coach. Never wanted to explain a thing because you feel like everyone should be as "smart" as you. It is a forum for helping people; not a place for you to get your therapy.

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally Posted by Badamk

You know who needs to reconsider being on the field? Guys like you who think they are the ultimate judge and better than everyone else. I dealt with umps like you when I was a coach. Never wanted to explain a thing because you feel like everyone should be as "smart" as you. It is a forum for helping people; not a place for you to get your therapy.

Stated in response to me explaining absolutely every pertinent point of the obstruction rule, and how it clearly applies. If you think my responses aren't appropriate, boy, just hang around this forum some more.

[Badamk]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

Stated in response to me explaining absolutely every pertinent point of the obstruction rule, and how it clearly applies. If you think my responses aren't appropriate, boy, just hang around this forum some more.

You know because of comments like this and umps like you, i'm done asking questions on this board. Don't forget you are out there to help KIDS compete and enjoy a GAME. That's it. You aren't there to show off how much you think you know or flex your self-appointed power.

So 'old man' take a deep breath and remember to use all those hours buried in a rule book for something good. New umpires come on here to understand the rules better and get some help. Maybe you can turn off the ego and actually help people.

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by Badamk

You know because of comments like this and umps like you, i'm done asking questions on this board. Don't forget you are out there to help KIDS compete and enjoy a GAME. That's it. You aren't there to show off how much you think you know or flex your self-appointed power.

So 'old man' take a deep breath and remember to use all those hours buried in a rule book for something good. New umpires come on here to understand the rules better and get some help. Maybe you can turn off the ego and actually help people.

Wow,

At least you are done asking questions here. One less clueless troll.

[bkbjones]

Originally Posted by Badamk

You know because of comments like this and umps like you, i'm done asking questions on this board. Don't forget you are out there to help KIDS compete and enjoy a GAME. That's it. You aren't there to show off how much you think you know or flex your self-appointed power.

So 'old man' take a deep breath and remember to use all those hours buried in a rule book for something good. New umpires come on here to understand the rules better and get some help. Maybe you can turn off the ego and actually help people.

Maybe YOU can quit thinking you already know everything and shut up and LISTEN AND READ AND LEARN AND GROW. Maybe you will some day go beyond just memorizing the rule book and read the umpire's manual, the case book, and learn there is also such a thing as rulebook right, ballpark wrong (among other things that can be learned if you'd just get off your hucking figh horse).

Otherwise, do NOT let the door bruise your @$$ on the way out. And stay the hell away from any field I am on.

[Badamk]

Originally Posted by bkbjones

Maybe YOU can quit thinking you already know everything and shut up and LISTEN AND READ AND LEARN AND GROW. Maybe you will some day go beyond just memorizing the rule book and read the umpire's manual, the case book, and learn there is also such a thing as rulebook right, ballpark wrong (among other things that can be learned if you'd just get off your hucking figh horse).

Otherwise, do NOT let the door bruise your @$$ on the way out. And stay the hell away from any field I am on.

Thanks for making my point even clearer.

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by Badamk

Thanks for making my point even clearer.

The only point you've made to anyone on this forum is that you are a troll coach not here to ask questions or learn but rather to act like..


well a troll coach.

You think you are the first troll coach we've seen?

You give yourself way too much credit. You are a dime a dozen.

Shooo.

[bkbjones]

Originally Posted by Badamk

Thanks for making my point even clearer.

You're welcome. Now get the %$#k out of our space.

[Steve M]

Originally Posted by Badamk

Thanks for making my point even clearer.

The point WAS clear, early on. It's you that's arrogant, but too unknowing to realize that you don't know. So, go on back where you came from and tell all of you like-minded friends not to bother trolling here.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Badamk

You know because of comments like this and umps like you, i'm done asking questions on this board. Don't forget you are out there to help KIDS compete and enjoy a GAME. That's it. You aren't there to show off how much you think you know or flex your self-appointed power.

No, that would be wrong. The umpire is NOT there to help the kids, that is the coaches' job. Umpires are there for one reason, the GAME, period. The umpire is there to ensure the participants enjoy a level playing field and that all the rules under which the participants agree to play are enforced equally and fairly. BTW, softball isn't just a kids game.

So 'old man' take a deep breath and remember to use all those hours buried in a rule book for something good. New umpires come on here to understand the rules better and get some help. Maybe you can turn off the ego and actually help people.

Talk about making something clear! You have made it quite clear that you do not know the rules and have little interest to do so. You have made it clear that you treat anyone who disagrees with your "belief" is wrong, an egomaniac and old. IOW, in this thread alone you have demonstrated you are clueless and choose to badmouth actual interpretations, not opinions, given by those who have umpired at the highest levels, been trained at the highest levels by those who ARE at the highest levels of the game.

You don't want to post any questions? Fine, but stick around and you may just learn something.

[Badamk]

Say what you want about me. I came on here admitting I needed help. I didn't ask a question because I already knew the answer. Unlike some of you, I can admit I don't know everything.

I came on here to ask a question because I had a situation that I wasn't sure about. When I asked the question I was told I needed to reconsider being on the field in the first place. Somehow you magically claim to know me and know how I officiate a ball game.

Keep the insults coming. It makes it a very inviting place for newcomers to ask questions.

[wadeintothem]

Call one of the most respected umpires in the fast pitch community, who was trying to NICELY help you, an "old man", mock him, then degrade him, then snivel?

You "coach", are a real piece of work... like so many of your ilk. I believe the term used by little ball guys "R.A.T." would be very appropriate, and perhaps how they came to think of your type in such terms.