Offensive encroachment??

[Robert Goodman]

Suppose the neutral zone is set, and team A is playing without huddling. A1, returning from B's side of B's line of scrimmage, stops at a point where he's still encroaching. The wing official says, "Here's your line of scrimmage" and points, and A1 stands offside and drools. A's snapper isn't over the ball yet, but is getting there. At what point do you kill the play in Fed?

[jTheUmp]

Same as you do it when the defense lines up in the neutral zone in FED... kill it just before the snap.

[bossman72]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

Suppose the neutral zone is set, and team A is playing without huddling. A1, returning from B's side of B's line of scrimmage, stops at a point where he's still encroaching. The wing official says, "Here's your line of scrimmage" and points, and A1 stands offside and drools. A's snapper isn't over the ball yet, but is getting there. At what point do you kill the play in Fed?

(just like if the D lined up offside) I would give him ample time to move back. If he did not, I will blow it dead and call them for encroachment.

[ML99]

I had a situation - REC lined up far in the neutral zone and didn't listen to me to step back.

1) what would you do in this case - if the player doesn't listen to you? kill the play before the snap? flag it?

2) what to do if the player readjusts and moves back - at the same time the snaps starts.

3) what to do if the player readjusts and moves back - at the same time the snaps starts + another player is in motion

I threw a flag since the play started and he was 1-2 yrds in the neutral zone at the snap. When I reported to the HR he asked me for the foul and I told him enchroachment Offense. He replyed "why didn't you kill the play before the snap - we can't give them a penalty now after the play is over".

[mbyron]

1. Depends on the level, but for varsity I'd kill it before or at the snap.
2. Assuming he's out of the NZ, legal.
3. I would not flag illegal motion the first time that happened, but talk to him. I won't get him for the motion because he's doing what I told him to do. If it keeps happening you'd have to get it.

Your white hat wasn't entirely correct, but I get what he was driving at. If you let the play go, you can't then call encroachment, which is a dead-ball foul. But he could still have signaled illegal motion or formation or something to penalize the foul and gone on from there.

[stegenref]

Originally Posted by ML99

1) what would you do in this case - if the player doesn't listen to you? kill the play before the snap? flag it?

2) what to do if the player readjusts and moves back - at the same time the snaps starts.

I had a play like #1) last night....several times. WR lines up in the neutral zone, then turns his head and points at me, then quickly looks back to the line of scrimmage without even waiting to see what I'd say / signal...so he didn't have a chance to see me telling him to back up. I killed the play right before the snap and threw the flag on him for encroachment.

I had play #2) earlier in the year, but didn't call it...I was on the defensive sideline, right in front of the coach, so he went ape when I told the receiver to back up and he was backing up at the snap. I looked up the rule and discussed it here online and basically decided it was a good no-call since he was moving backwards at the snap. Technically though, he should have been five yards deep at the snap to be legal.

[bossman72]

Originally Posted by ML99

I had a situation - REC lined up far in the neutral zone and didn't listen to me to step back.

1) what would you do in this case - if the player doesn't listen to you? kill the play before the snap? flag it?

2) what to do if the player readjusts and moves back - at the same time the snaps starts.

3) what to do if the player readjusts and moves back - at the same time the snaps starts + another player is in motion

I threw a flag since the play started and he was 1-2 yrds in the neutral zone at the snap. When I reported to the HR he asked me for the foul and I told him enchroachment Offense. He replyed "why didn't you kill the play before the snap - we can't give them a penalty now after the play is over".

1) Kill it and flag it.

2) If he was set for 1 sec, then ok. If not, it's an illegal shift.

3) If another player is CLEARLY in motion, then I'd flag it for illegal shift. If another player is just starting his motion, I would probably let it go.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by bossman72

1) Kill it and flag it.

2) If he was set for 1 sec, then ok. If not, it's an illegal shift.

3) If another player is CLEARLY in motion, then I'd flag it for illegal shift. If another player is just starting his motion, I would probably let it go.

If I'm telling another player to move back, it's unlikely I'm then going to flag him for an illegal motion or illegal shift. No impossible, but unlikely.

This is less likely to happen on a varsity game than during a JV/Freshman/Youth game.

[Umpmazza]

Originally Posted by bossman72

1) Kill it and flag it.

2) If he was set for 1 sec, then ok. If not, it's an illegal shift.

3) If another player is CLEARLY in motion, then I'd flag it for illegal shift. If another player is just starting his motion, I would probably let it go.

I like mbryon answers to this... I just think your booger picking here... he tried to readjust.. let it go and talk to the player afterwards.

[Refsmitty]

If he is in the NZ at the RFP it is considered encroachment by rule.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Refsmitty

If he is in the NZ at the RFP it is considered encroachment by rule.

100% on the test.

Now in real life....

Originally Posted by Refsmitty

If he is in the NZ at the RFP it is considered encroachment by rule.

Even before the snapper puts his hand(s) on the ball?

[Refsmitty]

Once the RFP whistle has blown - it is encroachment