First Postgame paperwork in 5 years....

[OrStBballRef]

Working my only JV boys game this season as the season ends this week. Coach is a little chirpy right off the get go and I quickly put a stop to it, but he doesn't heed my advice.

After a fast break situation in the 2Q in which I was lead on a fast break his team missed a goal on a 2-1 situation. Any contact on the play was minor and didn't affect the shot. Nothing even close to a foul. Head back up the court as the new trail and I'm in front of his bench "No foul on the play?" I shook my head and stated no and he then yells "You've got to be kidding me!"

Well there's #1 and after issuing it he stands there dumbfounded as to why he got it. He continues to stand and after the FTs I tell him he's lost his box. More look of confusion until the kids on the bench tell him he needs to sit down for the rest of the game....lol...players on the bench knew the rule better than he did.

2nd half rolls around and he periodically is chirping for calls, especially 3 in the key Partner on two occasions told him we'd look for it, but they aren't even close to 3 in the key. After a long possession with multiple shots for the visiting team I'm running by his bench and he again is chirping for it, but this time decides to yell 'Are you guys even looking at the key?!'

Easy #2 followed by the 'what'd I say?!" as partner tells him he needs to go. Game finishes without incident.

Other pearls of wisdom...at halftime as we are getting our coats he wants to talk. I'm really not in the mood, but I at least listen to him as I'm walking to the table. "I've only gotten 2 Ts in my life and that was the fastest one ever" "Coach, you're not going to talk to me like that and that's why you got the T." followed by "Didn't I deserve a warning first?" and then finally "Aren't you going to talk to me about it"

"No" was the only response as I head to the locker room....

Only my 2nd and 3rd Ts on the year and first (and 2nd) to a coach. I jinxed myself before the game as I was talking to my partner in pregame stating that I didn't expect any problems in the game as I haven't had many this year and the season is almost over. So that part is on me

[Mregor]

Well if you ever work a game of his again, he'll have no excuse because now he knows your limits.

The advice I've heard says once you warn or T a coach, the crew is done talking/listening to him.

[Pantherdreams]

I don't think the problem is yours are much as systemic. You held your standard and were consistent. IME though that is not the standard I see with my partners, in high school games, or I'm sure most coaches see regularly. If a coach then doesn't know you or your partner when they walk in to the gym they are just going to apply the regular standard.

The reality is I see a lot of games and work with a number of partners where if comments are not directed at a person specfically then they don't respond at all. ie. The coach just asking sarcastic questions out loud, making loud comments but not as part of a conversation, etc. = No reaction/T. So coaches don't feel like they are interacting with us or that we are impacted by their comments so they continue.

Then guys like you or me walk into a gym with expectations about conduct and unwilling to accept behaviour/decorum that belittles officiating/ the game and they are shocked when it happens.

[j51969]

Originally Posted by OrStBballRef

Working my only JV boys game this season as the season ends this week. Coach is a little chirpy right off the get go and I quickly put a stop to it, but he doesn't heed my advice.

After a fast break situation in the 2Q in which I was lead on a fast break his team missed a goal on a 2-1 situation. Any contact on the play was minor and didn't affect the shot. Nothing even close to a foul. Head back up the court as the new trail and I'm in front of his bench "No foul on the play?" I shook my head and stated no and he then yells "You've got to be kidding me!"

Well there's #1 and after issuing it he stands there dumbfounded as to why he got it. He continues to stand and after the FTs I tell him he's lost his box. More look of confusion until the kids on the bench tell him he needs to sit down for the rest of the game....lol...players on the bench knew the rule better than he did.

2nd half rolls around and he periodically is chirping for calls, especially 3 in the key Partner on two occasions told him we'd look for it, but they aren't even close to 3 in the key. After a long possession with multiple shots for the visiting team I'm running by his bench and he again is chirping for it, but this time decides to yell 'Are you guys even looking at the key?!'

Easy #2 followed by the 'what'd I say?!" as partner tells him he needs to go. Game finishes without incident.

Other pearls of wisdom...at halftime as we are getting our coats he wants to talk. I'm really not in the mood, but I at least listen to him as I'm walking to the table. "I've only gotten 2 Ts in my life and that was the fastest one ever" "Coach, you're not going to talk to me like that and that's why you got the T." followed by "Didn't I deserve a warning first?" and then finally "Aren't you going to talk to me about it"

"No" was the only response as I head to the locker room....

Only my 2nd and 3rd Ts on the year and first (and 2nd) to a coach. I jinxed myself before the game as I was talking to my partner in pregame stating that I didn't expect any problems in the game as I haven't had many this year and the season is almost over. So that part is on me

Assuming this means you work mostly V contests he was probably not ready for an experienced official/crew. We all have our own line, and you certainly gave him an opportunity to experience yours. Sub-varsity level officials sometimes allow to much of this kind of behavior IMO, because they think they have to for advancement. I would offer 90% of the technicals V coaches get they know are coming. Doesn't mean they will like it, but know its coming. General seperations from JV/V is pick a nit rule knowledge, proper game management, good solide mechcanics. JMO

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by OrStBballRef

... "I've only gotten 2 Ts in my life and that was the fastest one ever" "...

So after his first T, I'm sure he came up to the official and said "I've never been T'd before in my career".

And somebody has to be the fastest.

[JRutledge]

Someone told me a long time ago and this still holds true.

"If they roll the dice, they might just crap out."

It is not your responsiblity to lower any standard. I was not there and if he was doing nothing but questioning everything you do, you have a right to address this with a T. Too often officials just like bad behavior go and do nothing when confronted. And probably it sounds like you were probably more expeirenced than he was used to and that young officials (in years) probably never check him with that mess.

I threw a coach out earlier this year and I was OK with what I did. The coach did not learn and had to be taught. And yes, I gave both Ts and people went into this crap, "If you give the first one, you should not give the second one." Well that was not happening and I think that is a cowardly way to deal with things when you are giving them a chance to realize their behavior.

You sound like you did good and do not beat yourself up about it. I just know that I would have included that he confronted you after he was thrown out. You never know what he might claim later or suggest you said inapproriately. So I hope you reported that part to the people you answer to in these matters.

Peace

[Da Official]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

You sound like you did good and do not beat yourself up about it. I just know that I would have included that he confronted you after he was thrown out. You never know what he might claim later or suggest you said inapproriately. So I hope you reported that part to the people you answer to in these matters.

Peace

Rut, I was surprised in the post that the coach was still in the gym after receiving 2 Technicals to even have a conversation with the officials. Also surprise no one else brought this up. Or maybe I read into this incorrectly....

[OrStBballRef]

Originally Posted by j51969

Assuming this means you work mostly V contests he was probably not ready for an experienced official/crew.

Yup mostly V contests this year and you're exactly right about the varsity coaches know when they are coming. In all the games this year including some really tight league contests I only had a coach come close to the line 1-2 times and then backed off when we told him they were approaching the line. They got the message....

There was no postgame confrontation and my 'conversation' with him was actually at halftime as we were getting our coats at the table, ejection came in the 2nd half. And I agree w/ JRut that its not our job to lower our standards given the game. I wouldn't have tolerated that in a varsity contest or any level. Now I may not have heard that in a varsity contest as the gyms are usually more full and louder, but in that quiet gym on that day I did hear it and addressed it. The 1st T is warning enough that his actions crossed the line and he didn't get the message and he earned the 2nd one.

No question in my mind about either T was rightly earned by the coach. Slept fine last night. Considering this was my first T on a coach this year I'm chalking this one up to it being a late season JV game versus anything else...

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Da Official

Rut, I was surprised in the post that the coach was still in the gym after receiving 2 Technicals to even have a conversation with the officials. Also surprise no one else brought this up. Or maybe I read into this incorrectly....

Conversation was at half time, 2nd T came in the second half.

[OrStBballRef]

Originally Posted by Adam

Conversation was at half time, 2nd T came in the second half.

Yeah that was kind of a flow issue with my original post...

[OrStBballRef]

Sorry for the thread bump, but this one is too good not to tell.

So by circumstance I had to go back out to the same school I was at Tuesday night for a late season makeup game. I had the GV and the BV was to follow. Last game of the year and they had games going in both gyms, which included the JV game of the coach I booted the previous game. Now he doesn't get to coach as he has to sit out a game.

So as the GV is winding down and my partner and I head down to the locker room and the BV officials are waiting for us.

Both of them kind of have a smile/chuckle on their face and then they tell the story. They were up watching our game and waiting to be let downstairs to the locker room. When JV coach comes up to them and states 'hey you see that guy out there on the court (me)...he tossed me from a game on Tuesday.'

Now here's where it gets pretty funny....

Coach tells his story "I didn't really say anything and in the first minute of the game he's giving me a T." (actually about a minute or two into the 2Q) "Then about 30 seconds into the 2nd half he gives me another one and I'm gone. Those were really quick.' (it was about 1/2 through the 3Q).

Naturally they were skeptical of this so one of them asks this question "So did you deserve them?"

Per what they said it took him several seconds to fully answer the question. They never told me what his answer was, but his delayed reaction gave them the answer anyway.

Got to LOVE the nice dose of a little revisionist history there. My game was forgettable, but that story is going to carry me through the off-season (and probably beyond). Nice way to end the season with that little humorous series of events....

Ahhh coaches...what can you say?