Whistle at first horn

[RookieDude]

Originally Posted by Rich

I'm not all that concerned with a few seconds here or there. I know that if the team hasn't broken the huddle on the SECOND horn, I'm going to remind the coach to move things along.

The whistle usually gets them stirring, but if it doesn't, I'm just doing what I've always done -- getting in the huddle, encouraging them to break, etc.

Not putting the ball down unless a team is really insistent on not breaking until the second horn repeatedly -- or defiant.

...I'm in this choir and singing right along with ya!

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by RookieDude

Yep...more or less...at least near the huddle.



Hmmmmmm....kinda like "crying wolf isn't it?"

Usually a whistle means ball is ready for play (after a TO)...not excactly true in this case, since the team still has 15 seconds left of their TO.

It's no wonder the "huddles start breaking when they hear the whistle"...but, hasn't your crew just shorted the team the benefit of a full TO?

I guess if your whole association is doing it this way...it's consistent.

But, maybe the teams in your association are going to get spoiled with these whisltes and are getting set up for failure when they go outside of your service area.

Just a thought.

Rookie Dude:

I am with holding comment per the "whistle at first horn" but a team does not have 15 seconds more to its TO. Both teams are to be ready to play by the second horn.

MTD, Sr.

[zm1283]

I've tried this recently and it does work. It seems like when teams hear the whistle just after the first horn, it gets them stirring around and they end up coming out of the huddle either at the second horn or very close to it. It seems like when you don't use the whistle, they won't even start to stir until the second horn sometimes.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Rookie Dude:

I am with holding comment per the "whistle at first horn" but a team does not have 15 seconds more to its TO. Both teams are to be ready to play by the second horn.

MTD, Sr.

Their timeout is either 60 seconds or 30 seconds long. The horn comes 15 seconds before that time limit. So they aren't getting "15 seconds more to its TO". They are getting their allotted time. Making them leave their bench area at the first horn is taking time away from them.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

Their timeout is either 60 seconds or 30 seconds long. The horn comes 15 seconds before that time limit. So they aren't getting "15 seconds more to its TO". They are getting their allotted time. Making them leave their bench area at the first horn is taking time away from them.

I am guessing that after the second horn you wait for both teams to break their respective huddles and move out onto the court and a thrower comes to you to receive the ball from you, meaning that the teams are not ready to resume play by the second horn as required by rule.

MTD, Sr.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Rookie Dude:

I am with holding comment per the "whistle at first horn" but a team does not have 15 seconds more to its TO. Both teams are to be ready to play by the second horn.

MTD, Sr.

Disagree that they don't have 15 more seconds. They absolutely do if you're blowing the whistle after 45 seconds of a 60 second time out.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

I am guessing that after the second horn you wait for both teams to break their respective huddles and move out onto the court and a thrower comes to you to receive the ball from you, meaning that the teams are not ready to resume play by the second horn as required by rule.

MTD, Sr.

You are guessing wrong, then. Total time between the second horn and the time we put the ball in play is probably 5 seconds or less. But I do not make them leave their bench area at the first horn. Being ready to play does not mean that you have the thrower standing beside you already.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

What I am about to say applies to both 30 and 60 second timeouts. The warning buzzer is just that: It warns both teams that the ball will be put into play in 15 seconds; it means that the both teams are to be ready to play in 15 seconds. When the second horn sounds the administering official is to place the ball at the disposable of the team entitled to make the throw-in.

The administering official should not have to wait for team(s) to break it or their huddles after the second horn is sounded.

MTD, Sr.

[APG]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

What I am about to say applies to both 30 and 60 second timeouts. The warning buzzer is just that: It warns both teams that the ball will be put into play in 15 seconds; it means that the both teams are to be ready to play in 15 seconds. When the second horn sounds the administering official is to place the ball at the disposable of the team entitled to make the throw-in.

The administering official should not have to wait for team(s) to break it or their huddles after the second horn is sounded.

MTD, Sr.

Doing what I think you're suggesting...putting the ball immediately at the disposal as soon as the second horn hits...would amount to career suicide if one wants to do more than middle school ball. I agree we don't want to let teams delay the game too long after the 2nd horn, but realistic appliciation of the rules around timeouts and resuming play from that timeout dictate that you WILL wait for a short period of time to let teams break their huddles.

Of course, this is all IMO...and YMMW.

[refiator]

Originally Posted by Rich

We already do it this way.

It's not a "hurry up" tactic for us. The horn blows, the covering officials hit their whistles before the usual "First horn" and what it does is gets people moving towards ending the timeout.

We are required to do this. I have had more than 1 occasion in a loud gym where the teams did not hear the horn….You need to ensure that the head coach makes eye contact with you as you yell in the huddle, "First Horn, White". This way there is no reason you not to envoke resumption of play if needed.

[RookieDude]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

... a team does not have 15 seconds more to its TO. Both teams are to be ready to play by the second horn.

MTD, Sr.

I have been away from the board for a couple days...

Sooooo...not trying to pile on, Senior....but, what Adam, rockyroad and APG said.

[Drizzle]

I've adopted this over the last two weeks and found it to be largely successful. A quick tweet as I'm walking over to the huddle after the first horn and teams are much more likely to be breaking the huddle as the second horn sounds.

[RookieDude]

Originally Posted by Drizzle

I've adopted this over the last two weeks and found it to be largely successful. A quick tweet as I'm walking over to the huddle after the first horn and teams are much more likely to be breaking the huddle as the second horn sounds.

I'll say again...

Of course "it", (a quick tweet), should work...

But, doesn't it feel like your fudging a bit?

A "quick tweet" is usually done RIGHT BEFORE play is about to begin.

What happens when the next crew does not blow the whistle at the first horn?

Do these teams come to expect a whistle before they break?

[Rich]

Originally Posted by RookieDude

I'll say again...

Of course "it", (a quick tweet), should work...

But, doesn't it feel like your fudging a bit?

A "quick tweet" is usually done RIGHT BEFORE play is about to begin.

What happens when the next crew does not blow the whistle at the first horn?

Do these teams come to expect a whistle before they break?

Nope, not fudging at all. I'm a Wisconsin season ticket holder and those D1 officials tweet on the first horn all the time. Good practice, IMO.

I don't give a quick tweet before beginning play -- I give a pretty good blast of the whistle, then.

[twocentsworth]

At the end of time outs, we have several "tools" to use to get the teams out of the huddle:

1) 1st horn (oftentimes, that does not work by itself).
2) a quick/short whistle "very near the huddle" (I ALWAYS use this).
3) verbally saying "1st horn" (I ALWAYS use this as well).
4) since we know who the floor captain is....I use his name to get their attention: "Captain Steve! 1st horn - LET'S GO!" (in general, people listen better when you use their first name - it gets their attention).
5) as a last resort, i'll lean INTO the huddle and blow my whistle again. A FOX40 whistle a couple of feet from someone's ear usually does the trick (they usually do anything they can to avoid it happening again!).

Try them out in your next game....you may find them helpful.