Whistle at first horn

[RookieDude]

Originally Posted by Rich

I don't start the clock until everyone's in the huddle.

Yep...more or less...at least near the huddle.

Originally Posted by Rich

Guess what -- huddles start breaking when they hear the whistle much more effectively than when we come in simply saying, "First horn."

Hmmmmmm....kinda like "crying wolf isn't it?"

Usually a whistle means ball is ready for play (after a TO)...not excactly true in this case, since the team still has 15 seconds left of their TO.

It's no wonder the "huddles start breaking when they hear the whistle"...but, hasn't your crew just shorted the team the benefit of a full TO?

I guess if your whole association is doing it this way...it's consistent.

But, maybe the teams in your association are going to get spoiled with these whisltes and are getting set up for failure when they go outside of your service area.

Just a thought.

[Sharpshooternes]

Originally Posted by RookieDude

Yep...more or less...at least near the huddle.



Hmmmmmm....kinda like "crying wolf isn't it?"

Usually a whistle means ball is ready for play (after a TO)...not excactly true in this case, since the team still has 15 seconds left of their TO.

It's no wonder the "huddles start breaking when they hear the whistle"...but, hasn't your crew just shorted the team the benefit of a full TO?

I guess if your whole association is doing it this way...it's consistent.

But, maybe the teams in your association are going to get spoiled with these whisltes and are getting set up for failure when they go outside of your service area.

Just a thought.

Interesting, this question came up at our association meeting and the interpretation we were told is that coaches should be breaking the huddle at 15 seconds and play will resume at the second horn. I am kind of torn on the issue as I feel as long as the huddle is breaking at the second horn and team s are moving to their spots, that is good for me. They get to use their full time and the game gets back under way quickly.

[#olderthanilook]

I have the same reporting philosophy when reporting time outs to the table as Freddy. And, I transfer that philosophy to football, as well.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by RookieDude

Yep...more or less...at least near the huddle.



Hmmmmmm....kinda like "crying wolf isn't it?"

Usually a whistle means ball is ready for play (after a TO)...not excactly true in this case, since the team still has 15 seconds left of their TO.

It's no wonder the "huddles start breaking when they hear the whistle"...but, hasn't your crew just shorted the team the benefit of a full TO?

I guess if your whole association is doing it this way...it's consistent.

But, maybe the teams in your association are going to get spoiled with these whisltes and are getting set up for failure when they go outside of your service area.

Just a thought.

They should be breaking at 15 seconds, or getting ready to, anyway.

The odds of me putting a ball on the floor are about zero, but I'm going to do my best to keep everyone moving.

[johnny d]

I am never putting the ball on the floor. I will give a DOG if the delay is long enough to become an issue and then follow up with a T if the problem persists.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by johnny d

I will give a DOG if the delay is long enough to become an issue

Unofficially I'm sure?

[johnny d]

Originally Posted by Welpe

Unofficially I'm sure?

Yes, as unofficial as one can be while informing the offending coach and letting him know to get his players on the court and ready to play.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by johnny d

I am never putting the ball on the floor. I will give a DOG if the delay is long enough to become an issue and then follow up with a T if the problem persists.

You have ROP in effect in both FED and NCAAW. You can have a DOG first in NCAAW, but not in FED.

No T;

[Adam]

Originally Posted by johnny d

I am never putting the ball on the floor. I will give a DOG if the delay is long enough to become an issue and then follow up with a T if the problem persists.

I hope this isn't in a Fed game.

[johnny d]

Yeah, I forgot that the warning isn't an official Fed mechanic. This is something we have been instructed to do in most of the conferences I work in. Warning, then ROP, then T.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by johnny d

Yeah, I forgot that the warning isn't an official Fed mechanic. This is something we have been instructed to do in most of the conferences I work in. Warning, then ROP, then T.

Sure, I like to warn them, but it's not a "DOG" warning (at the FED level). It's just, "coach, timeouts are running a bit long, I need them ready to play at the second horn."

I've also found that it's extremely helpful (and practically required here anyway) to get into the huddle after the first horn. It's working here, I only put the ball down once or twice a season, and then only in ms level. High school coaches get it and are more likely to complain about the other team lagging than to try to stretch out a TO themselves.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by johnny d

Yeah, I forgot that the warning isn't an official Fed mechanic. This is something we have been instructed to do in most of the conferences I work in. Warning, then ROP, then T.

Originally Posted by Adam

Sure, I like to warn them, but it's not a "DOG" warning (at the FED level). It's just, "coach, timeouts are running a bit long, I need them ready to play at the second horn."

And then, it is still not a T. You just put the ball on the floor again. If they want to give up a possession by being slow resuming play, that is sufficient. The problem takes care of itself.

[RookieDude]

Originally Posted by Rich

They should be breaking at 15 seconds, or getting ready to, anyway.

...I believe the exact words are, "A warning signal for the teams to PREPARE to resume play is sounded with 15 seconds remaining." (5-11-2,3)

So that would go along with your "or getting ready to, anyway" statement...

but, somewhat different than "they should be BREAKING AT 15 seconds"...IMO.

Originally Posted by Rich

The odds of me putting a ball on the floor are about zero, but I'm going to do my best to keep everyone moving.

A whistle at the 1st horn should keep your odds at about zero...

[PG_Ref]

Although in FED, there is no DOG "warning" for delaying the throw in after a time out (ROP), if one or both teams commit a 5-sec violation, and then continues to delay, a "T" is warranted.
7-5
ART. 1

When a team does not make a thrower available, after a time-out (as in 7-4-4) or the intermission between any quarter (as in 6-2-3), the resumption-of-play procedure is used to prevent delay. The administering official will sound the whistle to indicate play will resume. In each situation:

a. The ball shall be put in play if Team A is ready or it shall be placed on the floor.

b. The throw-in count shall begin and if a violation occurs, the procedure will be repeated for Team B.

c. Following a violation by one team only, if that team continues to delay when authorized to make a throw-in, it is a technical foul.

d. Following a violation by both teams, any further delay by either team is a technical foul.

Caseplay
7.5.1 SITUATION A:

The administering official has reached a five-second throw-in count on Team A after placing the ball on the floor when A was not ready to resume play following a time-out. What happens next?

RULING: The violation is administered and the ball is made available to Team B for a throw-in, at the same spot. If a Team B player is not in position, the same procedure is followed. If both teams have violated, a technical foul will be assessed for any further delay by either team. Team A must now have a thrower available, plus all other players on the court and Team B must be on the court ready to play also. If either or both teams are not in compliance immediately, a technical foul shall be charged.

COMMENT: Each different time a team has delayed returning to the court after a time-out or between quarters, the resumption-of-play procedure should be used. However, if a team refuses to play after technical fouls have been assessed, the game may be forfeited. (4-38; 5-4-1)

[Rich]

Originally Posted by RookieDude

...I believe the exact words are, "A warning signal for the teams to PREPARE to resume play is sounded with 15 seconds remaining." (5-11-2,3)

So that would go along with your "or getting ready to, anyway" statement...

but, somewhat different than "they should be BREAKING AT 15 seconds"...IMO.

I'm not all that concerned with a few seconds here or there. I know that if the team hasn't broken the huddle on the SECOND horn, I'm going to remind the coach to move things along.

The whistle usually gets them stirring, but if it doesn't, I'm just doing what I've always done -- getting in the huddle, encouraging them to break, etc.

Not putting the ball down unless a team is really insistent on not breaking until the second horn repeatedly -- or defiant.