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  #16 (permalink)  
Old Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:16am
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Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
It is called common sense. Not everyone has that thing in their capacity.
Common sense would be to just apply the rule. Keep it simple and do it by the book.
What is wrong with that?
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:36am
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Originally Posted by Nevadaref View Post
Common sense would be to just apply the rule. Keep it simple and do it by the book.
What is wrong with that?
The problem with that logic is that you assume that the rules always are clear and concise. They are not always that way and there are real things that happen in games that are not clearly covered. Just look at your stance on many rules alone. Not everyone agrees with them and not everyone is mandated to follow them the way you suggest. And if all rules were so clear as you suggest, then we would not have debates over things like what can or cannot happen with many rules and current changes. We had a rule we could not even agree on here if Team Control was still a factor after a throw-in had completed and you are actually saying that "Follow the rule...?" OK, go with that one.

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  #18 (permalink)  
Old Tue Dec 11, 2012, 09:06am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
The problem with that logic is that you assume that the rules always are clear and concise. They are not always that way and there are real things that happen in games that are not clearly covered. Just look at your stance on many rules alone. Not everyone agrees with them and not everyone is mandated to follow them the way you suggest. And if all rules were so clear as you suggest, then we would not have debates over things like what can or cannot happen with many rules and current changes. We had a rule we could not even agree on here if Team Control was still a factor after a throw-in had completed and you are actually saying that "Follow the rule...?" OK, go with that one.

Peace
I'd agree with the sentiment, but the rule on this play couldn't be more clear.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old Tue Dec 11, 2012, 09:12am
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Originally Posted by just another ref View Post
What would make such a thing obvious? If the first guy is out of bounds, and tosses it to the second guy inbounds, who subsequently steps out, I think I would have the violation whistled before I had time to speculate about anything else.
It depends a little (or maybe a lot) on how the first guy got out of bounds with the ball.

It only happens maybe once every couple of games, but it's clear that the person OOB does not really have the ball at his/her disposal.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old Tue Dec 11, 2012, 09:17am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref View Post
Common sense would be to just apply the rule. Keep it simple and do it by the book.
What is wrong with that?
I don't see anyone setting aside a rule. The covering official is allowed discretion in determining when the ball is at the disposal of a team.
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old Tue Dec 11, 2012, 09:26am
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Originally Posted by APG View Post
The covering official is allowed discretion in determining when the ball is at the disposal of a team.
Based upon Gapper's OP, "had a kid take the ball out..." sounds like "at his disposal" to me.

From what I see, if someone else wants to take the ball out after the opposing team scores, just get over the endline.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:40pm
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Originally Posted by bainsey View Post
Based upon Gapper's OP, "had a kid take the ball out..." sounds like "at his disposal" to me.

From what I see, if someone else wants to take the ball out after the opposing team scores, just get over the endline.
+1 True, a part of the definition of "at disposal" is that the official has begun his count. But, many throw-ins are conducted so quickly that the count never starts at all. With this in mind, if a player picks the ball up and tosses it to another player, in any context, in doing so that player had the ball at his disposal.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:59pm
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Originally Posted by Adam View Post
I'd agree with the sentiment, but the rule on this play couldn't be more clear.
I agree, but I do not see anyone not applying the rule. They just choose to give sone discretion to what is actually taking place and might be doing something different than another official. That does not mean that one officials is wrong or not applying the rule.

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