Back court heat bulls game

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by fullor30

Disagree, number one complaint is failure to call travel wouldn't you agree.

I'm seeing more and more brain farts. This call wouldn't be palatable in a 7yr old rec league.

The NBA has different travelling rules than the NCAA and FED. And we have seen plenty of video posted right here in this forum showing NCAA officials failing to enforce obvious travelling violations. And we've also seen plenty of examples of NCAA officials incorrectly calling BC violations that did not occur.

So again, do you make the same statement about NCAA officials as you would NBA officials?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

So again, do you make the same statement about NCAA officials as you would NBA officials?

We don't at all. That is the part I do not understand either. We have certainly in the past month have shown a lot of questionable decisions by NCAA officials and no one said they did so based on entertainment. I guess it always bothers me when that is said because no one says NFL or MLB are doing things for entertainment when they have similar differences in philosophies based on the fact that they are pros and not amateur game.

Peace

[IUgrad92]

What other league or level of basketball would allow this type of play to happen? My contention would be that it is more likely to see this type of play allowed night in and night out in the NBA and not so much in the NCAA.

Are the rules in the NBA, as such, so that it's that difficult to recognize the pivot foot?

Corey Maggette travels six times in 1 play - YouTube

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by IUgrad92

What other league or level of basketball would allow this type of play to happen? My contention would be that it is more likely to see this type of play allowed night in and night out in the NBA and not so much in the NCAA.

Are the rules in the NBA, as such, so that it's that difficult to recognize the pivot foot?

Corey Maggette travels six times in 1 play - YouTube

Well, we know that Austin Rivers is allowed to travel and I think all past videos of egregious travels in NCAA games involved either Duke players or Tyler Hansbrough so me thinks it might be more of a Tar Heel/Blue Devil travel exception that applies to basketball universally.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Well, we know that Austin Rivers is allowed to travel and I think all past videos of egregious travels in NCAA games involved either Duke players or Tyler Hansbrough so me thinks it might be more of a Tar Heel/Blue Devil travel exception that applies to basketball universally.

LOL!!!

Well I think because of the universal hatred for those very successful programs we tend to see people point out videos of those programs. But I can show a few videos of obvious travels not called at other programs and players that we do not know as well.

Peace

[tref]

Originally Posted by IUgrad92

What other league or level of basketball would allow this type of play to happen? My contention would be that it is more likely to see this type of play allowed night in and night out in the NBA and not so much in the NCAA.

Are the rules in the NBA, as such, so that it's that difficult to recognize the pivot foot?

Corey Maggette travels six times in 1 play - YouTube

IDK whats funniest, the 6 travels or complaining about the foul.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by IUgrad92

What other league or level of basketball would allow this type of play to happen? My contention would be that it is more likely to see this type of play allowed night in and night out in the NBA and not so much in the NCAA.

Are the rules in the NBA, as such, so that it's that difficult to recognize the pivot foot?

Corey Maggette travels six times in 1 play - YouTube

What about the missed holding foul as Maggette is catching the ball or the handcheck that causes one of Maggette's travels?

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by IUgrad92

Are the rules in the NBA, as such, so that it's that difficult to recognize the pivot foot?

Corey Maggette travels six times in 1 play - YouTube

My son tells me ESPN's NOT Top Ten today had Lebron taking six steps from the top of the key before getting fouled....said he carried the ball like a football. Haven't found THAT video yet. But, I'm a lookin!

[APG]

The play in question:



Under NFHS and NCAA rules, this is a clear violation. It is not so under NBA rules. The defense bats the ball away...thus that ends team control. Turiaf then tries to control the ball..the first initial push to the floor could be considered control...thus he had a positive position in the frontcourt with the ball and the subsequent actions would constitute a backcourt violation.

If the calling official did not believe that constituted control, when Turiaf gains control of the ball, he's in the air...he has not attained a positive position with the ball. His right foot lands in the front, and his left foot appears as though it might have landed on the midcourt line. This would mean he attained a positive position with the ball in the backcourt...which in this case would be legal.

[Toren]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

The play in question:

Under NFHS and NCAA rules, this is a clear violation. It is not so under NBA rules. The defense bats the ball away...thus that ends team control. Turiaf then tries to control the ball..the first initial push to the floor could be considered control...thus he had a positive position in the frontcourt with the ball and the subsequent actions would constitute a backcourt violation.

If the calling official did not believe that constituted control, when Turiaf gains control of the ball, he's in the air...he has not attained a positive position with the ball. His right foot lands in the front, and his left foot appears as though it might have landed on the midcourt line. This would mean he attained a positive position with the ball in the backcourt...which in this case would be legal.

Great explanation.

I think the non-calling official had a terrible view of the play, it looked like he got caught moving toward the endline, then couldn't see the play at all, so instead of guessing he didn't have a whistle. I didn't mind the play at all, he didn't see it, so we don't guess.

I did mind his body language.

[APG]

Originally Posted by Toren

Great explanation.

I think the non-calling official had a terrible view of the play, it looked like he got caught moving toward the endline, then couldn't see the play at all, so instead of guessing he didn't have a whistle. I didn't mind the play at all, he didn't see it, so we don't guess.

I did mind his body language.

If you notice, the trail official had a less than advantageous position because the lead starts a rotating to the opposite side...but the ball gets swung to the wing table side and the lead stops his rotation and he's back. The trail was in the process of rotating to the new slot/center position when the deflection occurred. I still think he ended up getting a decent enough look...and the slot/center official helped out on the play as well and had nothing as well.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

Under NFHS and NCAA rules, this is a clear violation.

Agree.

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

It is not so under NBA rules. The defense bats the ball away...thus that ends team control. Turiaf then tries to control the ball..the first initial push to the floor could be considered control...thus he had a positive position in the frontcourt with the ball and the subsequent actions would constitute a backcourt violation.

If the calling official did not believe that constituted control, when Turiaf gains control of the ball, he's in the air...he has not attained a positive position with the ball. His right foot lands in the front, and his left foot appears as though it might have landed on the midcourt line. This would mean he attained a positive position with the ball in the backcourt...which in this case would be legal.

For that matter, I don't even think he had control until the last time he picked it up to pass it to his teammate (simultaneous with him stepping back into the frontcourt). His hands were never solidly on the ball until after he dropped it, hopped, and landed fully in the backcourt.

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

The play in question:



Under NFHS and NCAA rules, this is a clear violation. It is not so under NBA rules. The defense bats the ball away...thus that ends team control. Turiaf then tries to control the ball..the first initial push to the floor could be considered control...thus he had a positive position in the frontcourt with the ball and the subsequent actions would constitute a backcourt violation.

If the calling official did not believe that constituted control, when Turiaf gains control of the ball, he's in the air...he has not attained a positive position with the ball. His right foot lands in the front, and his left foot appears as though it might have landed on the midcourt line. This would mean he attained a positive position with the ball in the backcourt...which in this case would be legal.

Stop.......put down the telecaster! it's backcourt

And by the way, thanks for posting all these videos, well done, terrific discussion pieces

[APG]

Originally Posted by fullor30

Stop.......put down the telecaster! it's backcourt

You said yourself you have no idea "what they see/don't see in the NBA". As I said in my initial post, you didn't give enough information to say if the call was correct or not. No mention of there being a deflection by the defense (which is a BIG deal on this play). And after posting the play, it's not nearly as blatant as you made it out to be, and may even by a correct call according to NBA rules.

And no problem with the video...so much easier to talk about plays with video rather than A1's and B1's

[btaylor64]

Originally Posted by fullor30

Stop.......put down the telecaster! it's backcourt

And by the way, thanks for posting all these videos, well done, terrific discussion pieces

I won't post much on here at all anymore, but this is not a backcourt violation in the least!!! Even if he did control it we deal with momentum as well. What APG said is right, but one thing he forgot involving positive position is that we allow for momentum... We don't expect a player to gather the ball at the last second and then stop on a dime just for backcourt purposes. If he re-gathers after the deflection but his momentum carries him into the backcourt that is a legal play under NBA rules.

Like it or don't like it, it doesn't matter they applied the rule correctly.