Backcourt Violation Play

[just another ref]

Is NCAA rule the same as NFHS?

Did he have control inbounds?

[APG]

Originally Posted by just another ref

Is NCAA rule the same as NFHS?

Did he have control inbounds?

Yes, both rule sets are the same in regards to backcourt violations.

[referee99]

Once he pushed the ball to the floor I have player control.

[just another ref]

What if a teammate had made the recovery in the backcourt?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by just another ref

What if a teammate had made the recovery in the backcourt?

Why would that matter?

Same as if he caught it, ever so briefly, and fumbled into the BC.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Why would that matter?

Same as if he caught it, ever so briefly, and fumbled into the BC.

What did he do which defined control in frontcourt?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by just another ref

What did he do which defined control in frontcourt?

Dribbled. In the brief moment before it hit his foot, he had player control by rule.

[HawkeyeCubP]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

Yes, both rule sets are the same in regards to backcourt violations.

Technically not true anymore. NFHS rule now requires player control in front court for plays where ball touches a player in front court and returns too backcourt. NCAA doesn't. (I tripped on that earlier this season.)

[APG]

Originally Posted by HawkeyeCubP

Technically not true anymore. NFHS rule now requires player control in front court. NCAA doesn't. (I tripped on that earlier this season.)

Wording my be different but in application, the rules are the exact same.

[HawkeyeCubP]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

Wording my be different but in application, the rules are the exact same.

I don't think so. A1 in backcourt pass into front court that is deflected off or by an A front court player back into back court and first touched there by A is not a BC violation in NFHS because of this editorial change. (Think A player that doesn't catch the pass or isn't expecting it near the division line.)

[APG]

Originally Posted by HawkeyeCubP

I don't think so. A1 in backcourt pass into front court that is deflected off or by an A front court player back into back court and first touched there by A is not a BC violation in NFHS because of this editorial change. (Think A player that doesn't catch the pass or isn't expecting it near the division line.)

That's still a backcourt violation under NFHS rules. The player control portion that was added to the rule applies to when coming out of a throw-in.

[APG]

*9.9.1 SITUATION C: A1 is dribbling in his/her backcourt and throws a pass to the frontcourt. While standing in A’s frontcourt: (a) A2 or (b) B3 touches the ball and deflects it back to A’s backcourt. A2 recovers in the backcourt.

RULING: In (a), it is a violation. The ball was in control of A1 and Team A, and a player from A was the last to touch the ball in frontcourt and a player of A was the first to touch it after it returned to the back court. In (b), legal play. A Team A player was not the last to touch the ball in the frontcourt. Team A is entitled to a new 10-second count.

[HawkeyeCubP]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

That's still a backcourt violation under NFHS rules. The player control portion that was added to the rule applies to when coming out of a throw-in.

?
9-9-1 doesn't mention throw-ins.

Originally Posted by NFHS

9-9-1: A player shall not be the first to touch the ball after it has been in player and team control in the frontcourt, if he/she or a teammate last touched or was touched by the ball int he frontcourt before it went to the backcourt.

[tref]

Originally Posted by HawkeyeCubP

Technically not true anymore. NFHS rule now requires player control in front court for plays where ball touches a player in front court and returns too backcourt. NCAA doesn't. (I tripped on that earlier this season.)

So which one is it?

4-4-4
A ball which touches a player or an official is the same as the ball touching the floor at that individual's location.

9-9-1
A player shall not be the first to touch the ball after it has been in player and team control in the frontcourt, if he/she or a teammate last touched or was touched by the ball in the frontcourt before it went to the backcourt.

I could've sworn that they said adding team control on throw-ins was not meant to change any other aspects of the game except not awarding FTs when the offensive team fouls.

Originally Posted by HawkeyeCubP

I don't think so. A1 in backcourt pass into front court that is deflected off or by an A front court player back into back court and first touched there by A is not a BC violation in NFHS because of this editorial change. (Think A player that doesn't catch the pass or isn't expecting it near the division line.)

If thats not a violation, it will definitely be a technical foul as that is the expected call.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the "player & team control" part is in regards to a throw-in from OOB directly into the frontcourt.

[HawkeyeCubP]

Originally Posted by tref

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the "player & team control" part is in regards to a throw-in from OOB directly into the frontcourt.

That's what APG's saying, and what is probably, I guess, intended here, but the written rule contradicts the case 9.9.1.c. 9-9-1 does not mention throw-ins, so by my logic, it should apply to all backcourt situations - not just throw-ins.