Discussed in an association meeting last night...

[Adam]

Originally Posted by bainsey

Visualization, mostly. You mentioned before, Bob, the one area of the floor where both could get a good look at the shooter. Otherwise, wouldn't we have a simple case of ball watching?

Not necessarily.

[tref]

Sneaking a peak on shot attempts to assist the crew is far different than ball watching.

[jeschmit]

Originally Posted by tref

Sneaking a peak on shot attempts to assist the crew is far different than ball watching.

Exactly. I was told, "Don't be a ball watcher, but always know the status of the ball."

This means that if a shot goes up, I'm doing everything in my power to get an angle as to where the shot went up and if it is a 3- or 2-pointer if its right near the 3-point arc. Of course, I can't see them all, especially if I have something that needs my attention right in front of me...

[7IronRef]

In this scenario, what is the most important thing(s) to get correct?

1) Know if the clock started
2) Determine if shot was 2 or 3
3) Was shot released before the expiration of time

If the crew needs to have 2 people on the ball, then so be it. That is what everyone else is watching and will be posting on youtube

[Adam]

Originally Posted by jeschmit

Exactly. I was told, "Don't be a ball watcher, but always know the status of the ball."

This means that if a shot goes up, I'm doing everything in my power to get an angle as to where the shot went up and if it is a 3- or 2-pointer if its right near the 3-point arc. Of course, I can't see them all, especially if I have something that needs my attention right in front of me...

Most times, if I'm lead in two-man and the shot goes up anywhere but my area, I don't know if it's a 2 or 3. The two exceptions I can think of; transition plays and end-of-quarter shots where nothing else is going to matter.

[tref]

So basically your partner better get it & get it right?

Sneaking a peak doesnt take very long to do, 2 or 3 whistle system. Get a look at those feet & get back to your matchups.

The first time your partner marks an attempted 3 in the 1st half & the defensive teams coach goes off on you, "he's on the line!!" And you cant provide any help, I think you'll change your thought process on assisting with shots.

They hired a crew of 2 & if he dont look good, I dont look good...

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by bainsey

Visualization, mostly. You mentioned before, Bob, the one area of the floor where both could get a good look at the shooter. Otherwise, wouldn't we have a simple case of ball watching?

1) At the end of the game (or quarter / half) all officials should have an opinion on all aspects of the last shot. Depending on from where it's taken, they might nt have much to offer, but still, ...

2) Whether it's "visualization" or not, it still doesn't explain why you'd have one practice if the T makes the call and another if the L makes the call. Are you saying that T should look in L's area, but L shouldn't look in T's area (or vice-versa)?

[bainsey]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Are you saying that T should look in L's area, but L shouldn't look in T's area (or vice-versa)?

No. I'd like to know who had the three, who said it was a two, what angles both had on it, and how the team came to the determination that it was a two.

Additionally, in these parts, when a lead signals a three is good, the trail mirrors. (Vice versa, no mirror.) Did he trail clearly see the foot on the line? Instead of mirroring, I'd probably whistle pretty quickly if that were the case.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by tref

So basically your partner better get it & get it right?

Sneaking a peak doesnt take very long to do, 2 or 3 whistle system. Get a look at those feet & get back to your matchups.

The first time your partner marks an attempted 3 in the 1st half & the defensive teams coach goes off on you, "he's on the line!!" And you cant provide any help, I think you'll change your thought process on assisting with shots.

They hired a crew of 2 & if he dont look good, I dont look good...

We can't sneak a peak every time. And a coach working me by saying "his foot was on the line" is not the reason to change how you are officiating. Why would you trust the coach's rantings over your partner's judgement?

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by badnewsref

we can't sneak a peak every time. And a coach working me by saying "his foot was on the line" is not the reason to change how you are officiating. Why would you trust the coach's rantings over your partner's judgement?

+1

[Rich]

I met the official from the OP of this thread. He was working the JV game ahead of my varsity game tonight.

Nobody to this day had told him they got this wrong on the floor and that the varsity officials also got this wrong. I made sure I told him and told him exactly where he can find the rule, etc. Whether he believes me over the two from Tuesday that told him he was right, I don't know.

[Smitty]

Originally Posted by tref

Sneaking a peak doesnt take very long to do, 2 or 3 whistle system. Get a look at those feet & get back to your matchups.

The first time your partner marks an attempted 3 in the 1st half & the defensive teams coach goes off on you, "he's on the line!!" And you cant provide any help, I think you'll change your thought process on assisting with shots.

That's ridiculous. Does this pertain to all calls or just the 3-point line? Should I also make sure I double-check my partner's OOB lines? I can't get a good look at all 3-point shots - and I'm definitely not going to be sneaking a peak if I'm busy looking at my primary and other players. I have to trust my partner to do their job as much as they need to trust me to do mine.

[tref]

I guess it could be "ridiculous" depending on the level one currently works & the quality of camps they attend. Many officials who dont camp anymore or just attend local HS camps (giving out last decades information) have this thought process.

Nobody said every 3 point attempt...

The correct point value is far more important than an OOB call

99s are good PCA guys, Rs know whats going on in the GAME!

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Smitty

That's ridiculous. Does this pertain to all calls or just the 3-point line? Should I also make sure I double-check my partner's OOB lines? I can't get a good look at all 3-point shots - and I'm definitely not going to be sneaking a peak if I'm busy looking at my primary and other players. I have to trust my partner to do their job as much as they need to trust me to do mine.

Darned right. If I'm the trail, I'm not going to be looking at a 3 in the opposite corner *unless* it's a shot at the buzzer. I look there and who's getting the two-handed shove that frees up rebounding space?

Borderline 3's right near the division of responsibilities? Of course. I'm noting what I see and if I need to get in, I will. I've only had one partner mark a 3 this year and it was clear to me that the player had a foot on the line. Fortunately, the kid missed the shot.

[Smitty]

Originally Posted by tref

I guess it could be "ridiculous" depending on the level one currently works & the quality of camps they attend. Many officials who dont camp anymore or just attend local HS camps (giving out last decades information) have this thought process.

Nobody said every 3 point attempt...

The correct point value is far more important than an OOB call

99s are good PCA guys, Rs know whats going on in the GAME!

Ahh the old "if I went to a college camp I'm better than you" card. You certainly implied all 3-pt attempts.