Best way to report numbers

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by stiffler3492

Check your local listings kind of thing or is there something that works best for you?

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

It's on page three of this season's NFHS Preseason Guide. The NFHS instruction is to say "twenty-four," not "two-four".

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Do what the people you work for and respect do. There is no right way or wrong way really either way.

Here in my little corner of 100% IAABO Connecticut, where we use IAABO, not NFHS mechanics, we report, "Three. Two". We've been doing it that way for over thirty years. That doesn't make it right, or wrong, it's just the way we do it. "When in Rome ...".

JRutledge: I certainly agree 100% with your first statement, however I do have a slight problem with your second statement. According to Nevadaref's post, those states, and associations, that adhere to NFHS mechanics, and I realize that there are states, and associations, that don't, it appears that there is a "right way", according to the NFHS.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Here in my little corner of 100% IAABO Connecticut, where we use IAABO, not NFHS mechanics, we report, "Three. Two". We've been doing it that way for over thirty years. That doesn't make it right, or wrong, it's just the way we do it. "When in Rome ...".

Yep, same folks who are afraid of coaches, so they go opposite on FTs after they call a foul.

Over 30 years, eh? Curious. Do you still have the T administer FTs to the FT shooter? I mean, after all, it was done that way for over 30 years. What's the point in trying a method that might be better, right?

[stiffler3492]

Yeah, the preseason guide was where I read it.

I didn't have any problems yesterday, but that was a small sample size. Small gym, not a lot of people, and a great table crew.

I'm at the same place tonight, so I don't anticipate any problems. For a junior high school, they have a great table crew. Better than a lot of the high schools I've worked at (at least for freshman games).

[zm1283]

My first year or so I said "three-two". Since then I started saying "Thirty-two" and it has worked well.

The only time I mess up reporting is the one or two times a season when I report the number of the player who got fouled instead of the offender. That makes for an interesting exchange with the table crew.

[junruh07]

A couple of years ago when I was at my first clinic, the first guy I called a foul on was number eleven. I reported it as one-one. The clinician quickly told me to always report the number, not the digits. For most numbers it probably doesn't matter, but it sure makes double numbers a lot clearer in my opinion. The table crew might stop listening after hearing the first one, and not hear the second.

[stiffler3492]

For numbers like 11, 12, and the teens, I can see that. But for 22 or 32 or whatever, the scorer could get equally mixed up with hearing "twenty-two". Could hear twenty but not two.

Guess it's best to wait until you have the scorer's full and undivided attention.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by junruh07

A couple of years ago when I was at my first clinic, the first guy I called a foul on was number eleven. I reported it as one-one. The clinician quickly told me to always report the number, not the digits. For most numbers it probably doesn't matter, but it sure makes double numbers a lot clearer in my opinion. The table crew might stop listening after hearing the first one, and not hear the second.

While I agree that it makes more sense to use numbers instead of digits, I don't know that this is a valid reason. If the table crew is that bad, this will be the least of your worries. And as stiffler pointed out, they're just as likely to stop listening at "twenty" as they are at "four."

[M&M Guy]

When I first started, I was told to report the numeral with each digit shown. It kinda made sense, since the table only sees one number at a time when reporting with one hand. In the case of #11, I always wondered how it should be spoken as I show each digit - "e", "leven"? "elev", "ven"? Maybe say it all at once before showing the digits? Or say it after showing the digits? ...sigh...so many choices not covered by the manual...

Remember, this is all about communication - we are communicating to the table the number of the player charged with the foul so it can be properly recorded in the book. It doesn't matter if we say it the "proper" way, but don't speak loud enough for the table to hear. Or, I could be doing all of the "proper" mechanics, but my partners are doing it differently, and the table gets confused because of the differences. Usually the best way to communicate is through consistency, and the NFHS (or NCAA) has set up a reporting procedure so table personnel have a better chance of receiving what we are trying to communicate. But the bottom line is we still need to be able to communicate with the table.

[Rufus]

I once had a clinician explain it this way - "When you get change back at a store do they give you two-five cents or twenty-five cents?" That cleared it up but also speaks to what people are expecting to hear, especially at the scorer's table.

As has been said, though, do as they do/expect in your part of the world and there shouldn't be an issue.

[Texas Aggie]

3-2. If you say, "thirty-two", what do you say for 14? "Four-teen?" To me, that would cause more confusion than 1-4. Also, what about 00?

I have been doing 3-2 for almost 25 years and never had any table person with a problem related to that. If they didn't hear me, they weren't going to hear thirty two either.

I have to wonder if those writing these manuals saying "thirty-two" have ever actually officiated.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Do you still have the T administer FTs to the FT shooter?

BktBallRef: Man, do you have a great memory. That change was made when IAABO was still using the NFHS mechanics manual, so we changed when everybody else did. I can't even remember how we did it back then. Did the trail just administer the first shot, or was it all shots?

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

BktBallRef: Man, do you have a great memory. That change was made when IAABO was still using the NFHS mechanics manual, so we changed when everybody else did. I can't even remember how we did it back then. Did the trail just administer the first shot, or was it all shots?

All shots. Then we kept the shots to be taken visible. For a one-and-one, we would count with our trail finger wagging up and down. Then we had a quick up with the hand after the release so we could chop in time. Before the gap, of course.

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Here in my little corner of 100% IAABO Connecticut, where we use IAABO, not NFHS mechanics, we report, "Three. Two". We've been doing it that way for over thirty years. That doesn't make it right, or wrong, it's just the way we do it. "When in Rome ...".

JRutledge: I certainly agree 100% with your first statement, however I do have a slight problem with your second statement. According to Nevadaref's post, those states, and associations, that adhere to NFHS mechanics, and I realize that there are states, and associations, that don't, it appears that there is a "right way", according to the NFHS.

I was in VT for my first 6 seasons back. It is an IAABO state. "Thirty-two", not "three, two", was the law of the land.
Which is what we do here in FL. And is in the officiating manual.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by 26 Year Gap

"Thirty-two", not "three, two", was the law of the land. Which is what we do here in FL. And is in the officiating manual.

IAABO manual? My IAABO manual just says to "state the color and number". Now, technically, you may be correct, three two is not a number, just two numerals, whereas thirty-two is an actual number. But is it the intent of IAABO to demand that we state an actual number, or do they leave it up to the individual boards?

I would love to get an interpretation of this "mechanic" from Peter Webb, the IAABO "international" interpreter. Last season he observed all the state finals, boys, and girls, eight games, here in Connecticut, where three two is the "law of the land". He had a lot of constructive criticism for our guys: calling outside of primary coverage areas, passing on free throw violations, hit and run reporting of fouls, not using the stop clock signal, and not visibly showing all counts that need to be visible, but he didn't mention our guys reporting the numbers incorrectly.

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

IAABO manual? My IAABO manual just says to "state the color and number". Now, technically, you may be correct, three two is not a number, just two numerals, whereas thirty-two is an actual number. But is it the intent of IAABO to demand that we state an actual number, or do they leave it up to the individual boards?

I would love to get an interpretation of this "mechanic" from Peter Webb, the IAABO "international" interpreter. Last season he observed all the state finals, boys, and girls, eight games, here in Connecticut, where three two is the "law of the land". He had a lot of constructive criticism for our guys: calling outside of primary coverage areas, passing on free throw violations, hit and run reporting of fouls, not using the stop clock signal, and not visibly showing all counts that need to be visible, but he didn't mention our guys reporting the numbers incorrectly.

Our interpreter was on the NFHS rules committee for 4 years. I would say that would be a good way to go. I went to an IAABO camp in 2007. CT guys I worked with got dinged for pointing to the floor on a 2 that was near the arc. And Peter Webb didn't want any talking guys out of the lane, either. "Thirty-two" is a number. "Three. Two." is two numbers. But, do what you are told. Just don't assume it is that law of the land. Even in IAABOLand.