3 second question

[wanja]

Originally Posted by billyu2

From the NFHS Pre-Season Guide the following play is similar to the OP:
Even though team control exists on the throw-in, no player or team control has been established on the court for purposes of a three-second violation.

Thanks for the reference. Looks like the best that we got. I'm sure hoping this makes it to the case book or an interpretation release.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by wanja

Unless there is something to contradict rule 4-12, there is player control during a throw-in:

old 4-12: A player is in control of the ball when he/she is holding or dribbling a live ball inbounds.

new 4-12: A player is in control of the ball when he/she is holding or dribbling a live ball.

Again, unless there is a rule reference, case reference or interpretation stating otherwise, this would mean that, by rule, 3 seconds is in effect during a throw-in.Clarification and consistency is definitely needed, since some potential repeated violations would be obvious.

No, the rule still does not affect the time during the throw-in. 9-7-1 requires team control in the front court. OOB is neither FC nor BC in NFHS rules, so 3 sec would not apply during the throw-in.

The only affect the rule change would have would be during the time after the throw-in pass bounces in the FC (TC and FC status are now in place) and before a player gains control inbounds (at which point the applicable rules are the same as last year). At most, we're talking about 2 seconds or so, so it's not really that big of an effect.

And of course, now we have the direction from the committee stating their intent so we can enforce the rule as intended rather than as written.

[billyu2]

"The only affect the rule change would have would be during the time after the throw-in pass bounces in the FC (TC and FC status are now in place) and before a player gains control inbounds (at which point the applicable rules are the same as last year). At most, we're talking about 2 seconds or so, so it's not really that big of an effect."

Snaq, I don't think that is correct because it doesn't matter how many seconds elapse when the throw-in pass bounces on the floor and before it is touched by a player since the throw-in still hasn't ended. Obviously, we can't start a 3 count before the TI ends. I think what the caseplay above is saying is, for 3 second purposes, there must be player control (therefore TC) on the floor in the FC before any 3-count begins following a throw-in.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by billyu2

"The only affect the rule change would have would be during the time after the throw-in pass bounces in the FC (TC and FC status are now in place) and before a player gains control inbounds (at which point the applicable rules are the same as last year). At most, we're talking about 2 seconds or so, so it's not really that big of an effect."

Snaq, I don't think that is correct because it doesn't matter how many seconds elapse when the throw-in pass bounces on the floor and before it is touched by a player since the throw-in still hasn't ended. Obviously, we can't start a 3 count before the TI ends. I think what the caseplay above is saying is, for 3 second purposes, there must be player control (therefore TC) on the floor in the FC before any 3-count begins following a throw-in.

1. Based on the rule, why is it obvious?
2. When the throw-in ends isn't relevant to the rule.
3. The rule/case play does not say PC must be established in the FC. It says there must be team control and the ball needs to have FC status.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

...The only affect the rule change would have would be during the time after the throw-in pass bounces in the FC (TC and FC status are now in place) and before a player gains control inbounds (at which point the applicable rules are the same as last year). At most, we're talking about 2 seconds or so, so it's not really that big of an effect.

...

By that logic then you would have a 10-second b/c count start when a throw-in lands in the back court. (not arguing, just saying)