How far do you push?

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by tref

State tournament game... same thoughts Nevada?

edit....was typing up my play when someone came into my office....i hit submit a couple hours later only to see that Snaq posed essentially the same question.

Or this play....

Championship game, 15 seconds left, score within one basket ether way. A2 shoots and misses. A1, inches from the endline right in front of you lead, gets the rebound and finds himself surrounded by B4 and B5....no chance to get a shot up...10 seconds left. A2 tries to pass the ball back out to A3 but the ball sails way over A3's head into the backcourt where A3 retrieves the ball. The only players the ball ever had a chance of touching were A1, B4 and B5....all deep in you primary.

What would you do if A1 threw the ball such that it (A) was tipped by B4 or B5 and your partner(s) call a backcourt violation or (B) was clearly not tipped by either B4 or B5 and your partner(s)did not call a backcourt violation?

Your decision to act or not act has a good chance to change who wins the game.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Yesterday, I am officiating a boys' JrHS game at a local colleges boys' JrHS and HS team camp. I am the T as A1 is dribbling the ball in A's BC. A1 stops his dribble just short of the Division Line. When A1 stopped his dribble, both of his feet were in contact with the court. A1 then proceeded to step with his right foot into A's FC and then brought his right foot back into his team's BC. My partner, from his position on A's FC endline, sounds his whistle for a BC violation by A1, . I took the call away from my partner and gave the ball to A for a throw-in nearest the spot of the "BC" violation. Team B's HC didn't complain and even told me that he know it wasn't a BC violation.

MTD, Sr.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Yesterday, I am officiating a boys' JrHS game at a local colleges boys' JrHS and HS team camp. I am the T as A1 is dribbling the ball in A's BC. A1 stops his dribble just short of the Division Line. When A1 stopped his dribble, both of his feet were in contact with the court. A1 then proceeded to step with his right foot into A's FC and then brought his right foot back into his team's BC. My partner, from his position on A's FC endline, sounds his whistle for a BC violation by A1, . I took the call away from my partner and gave the ball to A for a throw-in nearest the spot of the "BC" violation. Team B's HC didn't complain and even told me that he know it wasn't a BC violation.

MTD, Sr.

I hope you made the preacher buy you dinner after that one. Or was it Jr?

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I hope you made the preacher buy you dinner after that one. Or was it Jr?

Neither of them was my partner in this game. If it was Junior, I would have made him walk home. LOL

MTD, Sr.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

A1 stops his dribble just short of the Division Line. When A1 stopped his dribble, both of his feet were in contact with the court. A1 then proceeded to step with his right foot into A's FC and then brought his right foot back into his team's BC.

Just want to double check something. The key to this call is that A1, holding (not dribbling) the ball, had his pivot foot in the backcourt the entire time. Only the nonpivot foot went from frontcourt to backcourt? No violation. Right?

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Just want to double check something. The key to this call is that A1, holding (not dribbling) the ball, had his pivot foot in the backcourt the entire time. Only the nonpivot foot went from frontcourt to backcourt? No violation. Right?

Billy, read what you quoted from Mark. Which part is confusing? If A1 were holding the ball and moved his pivot foot into the FC woudn't that be a travel?

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Billy, read what you quoted from Mark. Which part is confusing? If A1 were holding the ball and moved his pivot foot into the FC woudn't that be a travel?

BadNewsRef:

Go easy on Billy, the Red Sox can't seem to get away for those pesky New York Yankees and that is causing him to have trouble concentrating on basketball.

MTD, Sr.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

The key to this call is that A1, holding (not dribbling) the ball, had his pivot foot in the backcourt the entire time. Only the nonpivot foot went from frontcourt to backcourt. No violation.

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Which part is confusing?

Nothing is confusing. I'm just trying to clarify the situation, especially for Forum rookies.

4.4.1 SITUATION: As Team A is advancing the ball from its backcourt toward
its frontcourt, A1 passes the ball to A2. A2 catches the ball while both feet are on
the floor – with one foot on either side of the division line. In this situation, either
foot may be the pivot foot. (a) A2 lifts the foot which is in the backcourt and then
puts it back on the floor in the backcourt; or (b) A2 lifts the foot which is in the
frontcourt, pivots and puts it on the floor in the backcourt. RULING: In (a), it is a
backcourt violation. When A2, while holding the ball, lifts the foot which was in
the backcourt, the ball is now in the frontcourt. When A2’s foot then touches in
the backcourt, it is a violation. In (b), when A2 lifts the foot which is in the frontcourt
and places it down in the backcourt, the location of the ball has not
changed. The ball is still in the backcourt and no violation has occurred. (4-35-2)

On a related note: I tried to find the rule about a dribbler needing to have both feet and the ball in the frontcourt to gain frontcourt status, and I can't find the rule, or a caseplay. Could someone please point me in the right direction?

[PG_Ref]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

On a related note: I tried to find the rule about a dribbler needing to have both feet and the ball in the frontcourt to gain frontcourt status, and I can't find the rule, or a caseplay. Could someone please point me in the right direction?

4-4-6 ... During a dribble from backcourt to frontcourt, the ball is in the frontcourt when the ball and both feet of the dribbler touch the court entirely in the frontcourt.

[Camron Rust]

Play I had this last season....big game, big rivals, full gym.....

I'm lead with post players doing what they do. A bullet pass comes in from outside. Both players reach for the ball, neither get it.....it was at least 1 foot beyond either player's hands....not even close. I call B's ball. My partner comes to me...one I trust very much....and asks me if I want some help. I KNOW he would only come in if he had something important. I welcome the input. The defender on the passer brushed the ball as it was released...not enough to slow the ball down or deflect it more than a few inches but a touch nonetheless. I blow my whistle and announce A's ball.

Don't know if it changed the game but it made us a lot more credible as a crew.

[bainsey]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

I took the call away from my partner...

Clarification, Mark. How did you take it away? Did you immediately reverse it, or did you speak with your partner first?

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by bainsey

Clarification, Mark. How did you take it away? Did you immediately reverse it, or did you speak with your partner first?

I took it away immediately; Team A's HC was pretty suprised at my partner's call and he never left his spot on the endline. I think he know he had screwed the pooch (as they say on the Baseball Forum) and was glad that my actions kept A's Head Coach off his back.

MTD, Sr.

[bainsey]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

I took it away immediately...

That's what I thought. I have to admit, I cringed when I saw this, because I had a bad experience on the receiving end.

A number of years back, MS girls. Opening tip off, A-1 tips to A-2, who catches the ball with feet in the frontcourt. She pivots into the backcourt, an easy backcourt violation. My much older partner, without consulting me, immediately says I'm wrong, and gives the ball back to A at the division line. I'm too stunned to react. (Admittedly, that's on me.)

If I see something vastly different from my partner, I have no problem hustling to him and communicating it, and I expect the same from my partner. Whether my partner takes my advice is his decision, but I will never show up my partner by overriding him publicly.

[tref]

Originally Posted by bainsey

A number of years back, MS girls. Opening tip off, A-1 tips to A-2, who catches the ball with feet in the frontcourt. She pivots into the backcourt, an easy backcourt violation. My much older partner, without consulting me, immediately says I'm wrong, and gives the ball back to A at the division line. I'm too stunned to react. (Admittedly, that's on me.)

I'm assuming you're T & he's L?

Originally Posted by bainsey

If I see something vastly different from my partner, I have no problem hustling to him and communicating it, and I expect the same from my partner. Whether my partner takes my advice is his decision, but I will never show up my partner by overriding him publicly.

A1 dribbles from the Ts area & spins away from the T in the lane. As the play opens up to the slot, the ball is capped before he travels. Double whistle the T begins to form the travel signal but you know all he had was back & butts.
How would you handle it??

[bainsey]

Originally Posted by tref

I'm assuming you're T & he's L?

Yes, the tip-off is complete, and I'm the R.

Originally Posted by tref

A1 dribbles from the Ts area & spins away from the T in the lane. As the play opens up to the slot, the ball is capped before he travels. Double whistle the T begins to form the travel signal but you know all he had was back & butts.
How would you handle it??

Same answer applies. If I see something vastly different from my partner, I communicate it to him. We may discuss the sequence of events, but ultimately, it's his call to reverse.