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Old Sun Feb 13, 2011, 09:31pm
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I'm thinking about giving it up.

I just heard a rumor (which I believe, BTW), that our biggest conference in the area (that produces more than its share of D-1 players) is planning on going back to 2-person in 2012-13. That would mean all of our area conferences would be back to 2-person for conference play.

I was really expecting that by now we'd be 3-person across the board. I worked 2 big schools BV (2-person) on Saturday and I worked harder than I've ever worked -- working the perimeter as the trail and at times flying all out up and down the court. I thought my partner and I did a pretty damned nice job during the game and we got a fair number of compliments from some assignors and former assignors who were in attendance, but I'm reaching the point where I do not want to settle with a 2-person crew working these games anymore.

So I wonder if it's time to simply work football and baseball and take November through March off. It's something I'll really be thinking about this off-season.

I have contracts through 2012-13 (in some conferences) and I'll honor those, so I have another 2 years of games, but if I decide to pack it in I simply won't accept any more contracts.
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Old Sun Feb 13, 2011, 09:39pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichMSN View Post
I worked 2 big schools BV (2-person) on Saturday and I worked harder than I've ever worked -- working the perimeter as the trail and at times flying all out up and down the court.
I've said it before - I find working BJV 2-man my toughest. Fast, and mentally and physically draining. BV would be even more difficult.

Good luck on your decision and future Rich.
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Old Sun Feb 13, 2011, 09:49pm
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If it's true that basketball players have gotten taller, stronger, ticker, faster, more skilled along the way, the hard evidence would be to gather the 40 yard times for these athletes, average height, weight, and strength, and then find those numbers at the NCAA level in years gone by. I bet at that time, the NCAA had 3 officials.

Good luck with your discernment, Rich.
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Old Sun Feb 13, 2011, 09:55pm
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We are mixed here in Maryland, most boards seem to use 2, we have used 3 for more than 10 years. ( on varsity ) I think we get more calls right using 3 than if we used 2.

That should be the goal, getting it right. Maybe by 2012, they will see the light.
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Old Sun Feb 13, 2011, 10:02pm
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We had one moment where a coach was really annoyed at a call on Saturday night -- I called an illegal screen on a player who was clearly in the L's primary across the court. But since the ball was in the L's primary and was closely guarded, I had no choice but to expand and get this -- the screen opened up a shooter for an uncontested 3. With 3 officials, we'd probably have had the L strong side and the T over there gets the screen. When I talked to my partner after the game, he said he was forced to leave his look at that right before the screener "gave a little extra" and the defender ended up on the floor.

This is what we end up having to do with 2 officials. And in 2011 we shouldn't have to do this anymore. I don't mind the running -- I'm in the best shape of my life. What I mind is the fact that we have such a harder time working the game and getting optimal looks at stuff.
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Old Sun Feb 13, 2011, 10:13pm
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I'm in the minority on this topic. I prefer the 2-man system for basketball.

More to do both physically and mentally, which makes the game more engaging and exciting for the official.
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Old Sun Feb 13, 2011, 10:17pm
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Fortunately, the schools in NC have no choice. The NCHSAA mandates 3 man crews for all varsity games.

But if they changed back to 2 man tomorrow, my game tomorrow night would be my last.

It's an outdated, ineffective way of officiating HS basketball.
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Old Sun Feb 13, 2011, 10:27pm
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Financial realities in our school districts have brought this issue up in our most recent negotiating cycle. Fortunately, coaches in our district seem to wield enough clout to keep the bean-counters at bay. They actually seem to grasp the value of the third set of eyes.

I have done two and three man this year...Two man for sub varsity and three for varsity.

I have to say I would have to seriously reconsider whether I would continue if forced to revert to two-man for varsity contests. I view it as a giant step backward in terms of overall quality and professionalism, and not something I would want to be involved in. I wish you luck with your decision, Rich. I understand where you're coming from.
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Old Sun Feb 13, 2011, 10:48pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BktBallRef View Post
Fortunately, the schools in NC have no choice. The NCHSAA mandates 3 man crews for all varsity games.

But if they changed back to 2 man tomorrow, my game tomorrow night would be my last.

It's an outdated, ineffective way of officiating HS basketball.
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Old Mon Feb 14, 2011, 02:17am
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I might not quit if this happen in my area, but I would certainly stop working certain leagues or number of games.

Then again our playoffs are all 3 Person and I doubt they would go backwards. Also helps integrate newer officials into the system. Time will tell, but I would not want to go backwards that is for sure.

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Old Mon Feb 14, 2011, 03:02am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BktBallRef View Post


It's an outdated, ineffective way of officiating HS basketball.
+1 2man reminds me of a one room school house.
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Old Mon Feb 14, 2011, 03:25am
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In Socal...2 man at both JV and V...2 man even in playoffs and 3 man ONLY in last 2 rounds of the PLAYOFFS.

All about the $$$$$!
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Old Mon Feb 14, 2011, 06:37am
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Pleasant Report from the Mitten

Here across the lake from Rut the one conference who went to two-person for varsity for this past season, having reportedly regretted its decision, has decided to revert to three-person again next year. Apparently they found that the seasoned officials they had come to appreciate refused to make themselves available for two-person games and continued with their three-man crews, so these schools lost what they felt were the best officials for most of their games.
That leaves the sublevel games, especially the doubleheaders, for the AD's and superintendents to win back to three-person so as to provide the seedbed for varsity officials of the future.
I don't mind doing two-person. With a good, reliable partner it's a good system, and that's what I started with back when Wilt was still playing. But I do miss working with the veterans who chose not to do the same. Going back to three-person will be a welcome move on the varsity level. And if they keep wanting two-person crews for those F/JV doubleheaders, I don't think they're gonna be real satisfied with what they're going to end up with, as much as those guys really do try to do a good job.
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Last edited by Freddy; Mon Feb 14, 2011 at 08:11am.
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Old Mon Feb 14, 2011, 07:33am
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Old refs

Quote:
Originally Posted by grunewar View Post
I've said it before - I find working BJV 2-man my toughest. Fast, and mentally and physically draining. BV would be even more difficult.

Good luck on your decision and future Rich.
Seems like you guys are just getting OLD, maybe let these YOUNG refs in that can "RUN" or be "mentally" able to handle a 2 man game. (not that hard....) I don't see any reason to have 3 officials. If the TWO officials are "on the same page" (so to speak) then they should be MORE than adequate.
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Old Mon Feb 14, 2011, 07:38am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThatOneRef View Post
Seems like you guys are just getting OLD, maybe let these YOUNG refs in that can "RUN" or be "mentally" able to handle a 2 man game. (not that hard....) I don't see any reason to have 3 officials. If the TWO officials are "on the same page" (so to speak) then they should be MORE than adequate.
I really don't care how young anyone is or how well they can run, a 2 man crew is going to miss calls.

If they miss only 2 or 3 calls the whole game, it can make a difference in a 3 point game.

Besides, the older guys, call a better game. It's called experience.
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