Time out

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Also, the rule referred to above does not address player control. The rule refers to physically controlling the ball, not team or player control.

This is where I disagree. I think the rule IS talking about player control....that it is lost when another player also has their hands on the ball.

[TheBest]

So since there is only 1 ball only 1 team can have PC/TC.
So when B1 grabs the ball can one correctly argue that the ball is no longer in play and as such is really a dead ball ie free for any team to get control off? (and if they can't a jump ball etc etc)

If this thinking is correct (idea based on discussion above) no coach should be able to ask for a TO.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by TheBest

So since there is only 1 ball only 1 team can have PC/TC.
So when B1 grabs the ball can one correctly argue that the ball is no longer in play and as such is really a dead ball ie free for any team to get control off? (and if they can't a jump ball etc etc)

If this thinking is correct (idea based on discussion above) no coach should be able to ask for a TO.

Do you even know what a dead ball is?
Your thinking is not correct.

[TheBest]

I hit the enter key after using the words "dead ball". Thanks for correcting me
So if no PC or TC the ball is in play and belongs to no one. Thus NO TO can be called. What is wrong with that?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by TheBest

I hit the enter key after using the words "dead ball". Thanks for correcting me
So if no PC or TC the ball is in play and belongs to no one. Thus NO TO can be called. What is wrong with that?

There is team control still, as nothing has happened to end it. The only time you'll have a live ball on the court with no team control is during and following either a try or a throw in.

If a coach requests a TO during the time I'm trying to decide if I should call a held ball, it's still a held ball.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

The only time you'll have a live ball on the court with no team control is during and following either a try or a throw in.

Quibble: I think you forgot one.

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Quibble: I think you forgot one.

Easy to do since the advent of the AP.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Quibble: I think you forgot one.

Yep, and I hereby sentence myself to penance.

[Mregor]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

There is team control still, as nothing has happened to end it. The only time you'll have a live ball on the court with no team control is during and following either a try or a throw in.

Agreed.

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

If a coach requests a TO during the time I'm trying to decide if I should call a held ball, it's still a held ball.

Why? If you haven't called a held ball, it's by default, still PC/TC of the person who had it. To me, this is simple. Grant TO for original team in control up until the point you deem it a held ball. If you deem it a held ball prior to hearing the TO request, then call the held ball. That's the 2 choices here. Either it was a held ball before the TO request (held ball) or the TO was prior to the held ball (grant TO).

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Mregor

Why? If you haven't called a held ball, it's by default, still PC/TC of the person who had it. To me, this is simple. Grant TO for original team in control up until the point you deem it a held ball. If you deem it a held ball prior to hearing the TO request, then call the held ball. That's the 2 choices here. Either it was a held ball before the TO request (held ball) or the TO was prior to the held ball (grant TO).

Exactly.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Mregor

Why? If you haven't called a held ball, it's by default, still PC/TC of the person who had it. To me, this is simple. Grant TO for original team in control up until the point you deem it a held ball. If you deem it a held ball prior to hearing the TO request, then call the held ball. That's the 2 choices here. Either it was a held ball before the TO request (held ball) or the TO was prior to the held ball (grant TO).

Frankly, because there's no time requirement for a held ball. The held ball starts when the players have grasped it, even if it takes me a second to recognize the situation.