Excessive swinging of elbows

[MathReferee]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

In all positions the defender can assume a legal, vertical stance as close as possible to the player with the ball. But no matter how close the defender gets, he still has to allow the player with the ball to make a legal pivot. If contact occurs with the elbow while the player with the ball is making a legal pivot, then the defender did not attain the legal, vertical stance needed by rule.

Serious question: Is this comment in bold supported by rule? I know 4-23-1 gives us the guideline that there is no minimum distance a defender must give for guarding, as you pointed out. However, I have just never read anything about giving an offensive player room to make a legal pivot.

In regards to the play, I agree with Jurassic in that you have to see these plays on a case by case basis. If elbows are extended in order to create space and they make contact with a defender I am going with PC more times than not. To echo someone else that asked, wasn't this a POE for NCAA last year after the Hansborough incident? I seem to recall Adams viewing this type of contact as a PC foul and possibly intentional.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by AustinRef

...To echo someone else that asked, wasn't this a POE for NCAA last year after the Hansborough incident? I seem to recall Adams viewing this type of contact as a PC foul and possibly intentional.

Look above your post.

[MathReferee]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Look above your post.

Yeah, timing is awesome...

EDIT: Or, actually reading through the whole thread first woudl help...