Causing concussions

[Back In The Saddle]

The rules do not talk about concussions. The rules talk about a player who is, in the opinion of the official, apparently unconscious.

[chseagle]

Originally Posted by johnnyrao

I do have a general question about concussions, though. I don't have my rule book, so I am not sure of the exact wording, but doesn't it say that a player with a concussion may not return without a doctor's permission. Does this mean for that particular game or for any further games? If it is for future games, how do you know? Do any states require the officials to file a report with their assignor when it appears a player received a concussion so that the crew doing the next game is aware? Or is that something that becomes a game management issue that we don't want to deal with. Seems to me it would be very hard for us to enforce and it's something I never had a crew talk about in a pre-game.

Here in Washington State, we have a new law that just got passed this past summer. The Zackery Lystedt Law is named after a young man who went back into competition after suffering a concussion & now is in a wheelchair.

More information about this can be found at: WIAA | Washington Interscholastic Activities Association

How it is written, if a student-athlete suffers a concussion, they are not allowed to practice or compete until they are clearing by a medical professional trained in treating concussions.

On the website listed above, I am not seeing anything concerning official resources, it wouldn't surprise me however if the WOA does have something.

The CDC resource sheets also state that the student-athlete needs get approval from a medical professional to return to competition/practice after suffering a concussion.

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by chseagle

Here in Washington State, we have a new law that just got passed this past summer. The Zackery Lystedt Law is named after a young man who went back into competition after suffering a concussion & now is in a wheelchair.

More information about this can be found at: WIAA | Washington Interscholastic Activities Association

How it is written, if a student-athlete suffers a concussion, they are not allowed to practice or compete until they are clearing by a medical professional trained in treating concussions.

On the website listed above, I am not seeing anything concerning official resources, it wouldn't surprise me however if the WOA does have something.

The CDC resource sheets also state that the student-athlete needs get approval from a medical professional to return to competition/practice after suffering a concussion.

I'm sorry if I'm coming across rudely, but you've told us about this law at least three times now. What is it that you need to know from this officiating forum?

johnnyrao,
As others have said, the only time we need a doctor's note is when the player has been unconscious.

[Ignats75]

I want to know one thing. If you are working the table, what are you doing looking down at the end of the bench at the player? How many times do I say, you need to focus on YOUR job?

[chseagle]

Originally Posted by Ignats75

I want to know one thing. If you are working the table, what are you doing looking down at the end of the bench at the player? How many times do I say, you need to focus on YOUR job?

I wasn't working table during the Girls' V game. I was crowd control.

[ref3808]

From a basketball officiating standpoint there's not much to add, but I'm curious as to why there was no athletic trainer present. In MA (I believe) it's a requirement to have a trainer at the game. Usually teams don't travel with a trainer but the home team trainer will cover both teams and certainly would have been involved with a player who doesn't get back up after a hit.

Seems odd, there is a law about concussions and further participation in the state but no requirement that someone qualified be onsite to provide care?

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

The rules do not yet talk about concussions.

Fixed it for ya.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

The rules do not talk about concussions. The rules talk about a player who is, in the opinion of the official, apparently unconscious.

Right. And, they apply only for that game. There's no way, as Johnnyrao suggested in his question, for us to know or enforce what happened in a previous game. I'd guess that the same is ture in Washington, with whatever that law is called.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

The rules do not talk about concussions. The rules talk about a player who is, in the opinion of the official, apparently unconscious.

However, as Nevadaref was so kind to post earlier, there was a NFHS Point of Emphasis a few years ago:

Point of Emphasis for 2006-07
Proper Procedures for Handling Apparent Concussions
If you suspect that a player has a concussion, you should take the following steps:
1. Remove athlete from play.
2. Ensure athlete is evaluated by an appropriate health care professional. Do not try to judge the seriousness of the injury yourself.
3. Inform athlete's parents or guardians about the known or possible concussion and give them the fact sheet on concussion.
4. Allow the athlete to return to play only with permission from an appropriate health care professional.

As I recall, initially there was some confusion about the identity of "you", and the NFHS later came out with an interpretation that "you" did not refer to the officials, but, rather, to the coach, site director, trainer, etc.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

As I recall, initially there was some confusion about the identity of "you", and the NFHS later came out with an interpretation that "you" did not refer to the officials, but, rather, to the coach, site director, trainer, etc.

It doesn't apply to the scorer or the locker room guard? Zackery Lystedt will be disappointed to learn this.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

As I recall, initially there was some confusion about the identity of "you", and the NFHS later came out with an interpretation that "you" did not refer to the officials, but, rather, to the coach, site director, trainer, etc.

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

It doesn't apply to the scorer or the locker room guard?

That's who the "etc." was referring to. Anybody, but not the officials.

[biggravy]

Chseagle,

Not to get too personal, but you've made several references to your neurological conditions and now some references to your 8th grade track and field days. Care to elaborate on what exact neurological conditions you have? Is Aspergers one of them? How far removed are you from the 8th grade track program? How long have you been out of high school? What is your exact job at the table? Help us to better understand where you are coming from.

The reason I ask all this: I have a friend who tells everyone he works at xxxx Fire/EMS Dept. with me. When people start asking questions, he backs down to well he washes the fire trucks. Really, he has Asperger's. He can't work. He is a great guy and hangs out with us as much as he can. You and your posts remind me alot of him.

If we know more about you, maybe it would help us understand what you are looking for. Most of us are referees. We want to be better referees. When someone joins a referee forum that is not a referee, it is best to clearly and honestly explain your exact relation to the game and what you are looking for here so we can more clearly understand you.

[chseagle]

Originally Posted by ref3808

From a basketball officiating standpoint there's not much to add, but I'm curious as to why there was no athletic trainer present. In MA (I believe) it's a requirement to have a trainer at the game. Usually teams don't travel with a trainer but the home team trainer will cover both teams and certainly would have been involved with a player who doesn't get back up after a hit.

Seems odd, there is a law about concussions and further participation in the state but no requirement that someone qualified be onsite to provide care?

From my understatnding, here in Washington the only interscholastic sport where any medical personnel are required to be on-site is for football. For as long as I can remember, my alma mater has not had an Athletic Trainer.

Originally Posted by BillyMac

However, as Nevadaref was so kind to post earlier, there was a NFHS Point of Emphasis a few years ago:

Point of Emphasis for 2006-07
Proper Procedures for Handling Apparent Concussions
If you suspect that a player has a concussion, you should take the following steps:
1. Remove athlete from play.
2. Ensure athlete is evaluated by an appropriate health care professional. Do not try to judge the seriousness of the injury yourself.
3. Inform athlete's parents or guardians about the known or possible concussion and give them the fact sheet on concussion.
4. Allow the athlete to return to play only with permission from an appropriate health care professional.

As I recall, initially there was some confusion about the identity of "you", and the NFHS later came out with an interpretation that "you" did not refer to the officials, but, rather, to the coach, site director, trainer, etc.

I've researched some more stuff online, besides the WIAA website, everything I've been reading refers to the player's coach.

Originally Posted by biggravy

Chseagle,

Not to get too personal, but you've made several references to your neurological conditions and now some references to your 8th grade track and field days. Care to elaborate on what exact neurological conditions you have? Is Aspergers one of them? How far removed are you from the 8th grade track program? How long have you been out of high school? What is your exact job at the table? Help us to better understand where you are coming from.

The reason I ask all this: I have a friend who tells everyone he works at xxxx Fire/EMS Dept. with me. When people start asking questions, he backs down to well he washes the fire trucks. Really, he has Asperger's. He can't work. He is a great guy and hangs out with us as much as he can. You and your posts remind me alot of him.

If we know more about you, maybe it would help us understand what you are looking for. Most of us are referees. We want to be better referees. When someone joins a referee forum that is not a referee, it is best to clearly and honestly explain your exact relation to the game and what you are looking for here so we can more clearly understand you.

The two neurological disorders I have: are seizure disorder & hydrocephalus (excess CerebroSpinal Fluid on the brain). The seizure disorder is being treated with medication & diet. The hydrocephalus is being controlled with a VentriculoPeritoneal (VP) Shunt. The seizure disorder I had more severely when I was an infant, but it subsided until after I was out of school.

For high school, I am considered a member of the Class of 1999 but due to complications of the hydrocephalus in my freshman year, I was unable to graduate high school, but do have a GED. My 8th grade year would of been 1994-1995. In 8th grade track, the events I competed in were shot put & discus. I did track on 8th grade, to see if I could handle it or not, as a personal dare to myself.

Due to the hydrocephalus, I am prohibited from participating from any sport considered to be a contact sport (any Interscholastic Athletic except: Track & Field, XC, or Swimming) as a player. However I can participate as bench personnel (team manager or statitician). In high school I was both Football Manager & Boys' Basketball Manager.

[johnnyrao]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Right. And, they apply only for that game. There's no way, as Johnnyrao suggested in his question, for us to know or enforce what happened in a previous game. I'd guess that the same is ture in Washington, with whatever that law is called.

Thanks Bob, clears it up for me.

[chseagle]

Found out tonight, that thankfully, the player didn't have a concussion as I hsaw her practicing with the team, before the Boys' games.