Spot Throw In Violation - PSU v GM NIT

[Adam]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Well.

Y'know, that's a deep subject.

Yup, runs in my family.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by CallMeMrRef

He actually may have maintained one foot on or over the 3 foot throw in spot, which would not be a violation.

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

The 3 foot spot is not that big. It's not three feet in each direction, it's three feet total; 1.5 feet in each direction. I haven't seen the play, so I can't say what I think it was, but there is not a lot of room for lateral movement on a spot throwin.

Snaqwells: Sorry, but I beg to differ. The designated "spot" is three feet wide. He can move as much as he wants within that "spot", also, the inbounder is only required to have one foot over that three foot wide "spot". If he's on the left side of that "spot", he can take one step to the left, still keeping his right foot over the designated "spot". If he's over on the right side of that "spot", he can take one step to the right, still keeping his left foot over the designated "spot". Remember, the "spot" itself is three feet wide. If the player is tall enough, he can probably step at least three feet to the left, and three feet to the right, for a total of nine feet, without violating, as long as this is completed in less than five seconds.

[mutantducky]

well anyways the first time i saw the wrong once, but i was mistaken quote was from The Monkey Wrench Gang by Edward Abbey

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Snaqwells: Sorry, but I beg to differ. The designated "spot" is three feet wide. He can move as much as he wants within that "spot", also, the inbounder is only required to have one foot over that three foot wide "spot". If he's on the left side of that "spot", he can take one step to the left, still keeping his right foot over the designated "spot". If he's over on the right side of that "spot", he can take one step to the right, still keeping his left foot over the designated "spot". Remember, the "spot" itself is three feet wide. If the player is tall enough, he can probably step at least three feet to the left, and three feet to the right, for a total of nine feet, without violating, as long as this is completed in less than five seconds.

I'd even go so far as to say this number is easily 9 feet for an average height player (average being around 6'). I can, in my 40's and 6' tall, step to the side with my feet substantially more then 3 feet apart....probably 4 feet without straining/stretching....covering a range of about 11 feet. A taller player could easily cover even more...probably closer to 12 or 13 feet from limit to limit.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

A taller player could easily cover even more...probably closer to 12 or 13 feet from limit to limit.

Like this guy?

http://ac4.yt-thm-a02.yimg.com/image/0eeade9fb6d8f32c

Manute Bol has spent most of the income from his NBA playing days funding relief efforts in the Dufar region of the Sudan, his home country. He was involved in a near fatal automobile accident a few years ago. Now that he has recovered, he's back on the fund raising circuit. Now there's a role model for our younger players who may want, or need, someone to pattern their life after, except maybe for the killing a lion with only a spear part.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Snaqwells: Sorry, but I beg to differ. The designated "spot" is three feet wide. He can move as much as he wants within that "spot", also, the inbounder is only required to have one foot over that three foot wide "spot". If he's on the left side of that "spot", he can take one step to the left, still keeping his right foot over the designated "spot". If he's over on the right side of that "spot", he can take one step to the right, still keeping his left foot over the designated "spot". Remember, the "spot" itself is three feet wide. If the player is tall enough, he can probably step at least three feet to the left, and three feet to the right, for a total of nine feet, without violating, as long as this is completed in less than five seconds.

With all due respect, you're not really contradicting me. I said nothing about how much ground the thrower can cover, only how large that spot is. Yes, as long as one foot is over the spot, he's good, and most players can "cover" quite a bit of floor space legally. That said, how many players stretch that far to one direction with one foot back to make a throw? Very few, if a player steps that far, he normally brings his back foot with him; thus a violation.

My point was simply that the "spot" extends only about 1.5 feet in each direction.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

My point was simply that the "spot" extends only about 1.5 feet in each direction.

In reality it is a judgment call. I do not sit there with tape and a measure to make sure a kid is exactly in a 3 foot area.

Peace

[Adam]

I measure the floor boards before each game to determine how many floor boards in a foot. It helps with the closely guarded counts as well.

[All_Heart]

What if the designated spot throw-in is on the endline in the corner right next to the sideline? Is the player allowed to move 3 feet to his/her left or only 1.5 feet? I've tried to add a crude drawing.

{-1.5 ft-}
{-------3 ft------}

X
|--------------------
|
|
|
|
|

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by All_Heart

What if the designated spot throw-in is on the endline in the corner right next to the sideline? Is the player allowed to move 3 feet to his/her left or only 1.5 feet? I've tried to add a crude drawing.

{-1.5 ft-}
{-------3 ft------}

X
|--------------------
|
|
|
|
|

If you're going to put them in the "exact" corner, I'd propose that they get 1.5 feet around each side of the corner!

That said, I don't judge spot violations this way at all. I don't consider it to be an exact spot so much as the maximum amont they move from side to side. There is just too much imprecision in observing a specific but unmarked spot...is it where their left foot is, their right foot, half-way between? Or even perhaps outside their feet if they're being stubborn about coming to the spot (desiring a better location)...in which case I don't give them so much leeway in the desired direction.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

The 3 foot spot is not that big. It's not three feet in each direction, it's three feet total; 1.5 feet in each direction. I haven't seen the play, so I can't say what I think it was, but there is not a lot of room for lateral movement on a spot throwin.

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Snaqwells: Sorry, but I beg to differ.

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

With all due respect, you're not really contradicting me. I said nothing about how much ground the thrower can cover, only how large that spot is.

You "said nothing about how much ground the thrower can cover"? What does, "there is not a lot of room for lateral movement on a spot throwin", mean? There is a lot of room for lateral movement on a spot throwin, anywhere from about seven feet for a shorter player, to about twelve, or thirteen feet, for a player like Manute Bol, as was pointed out by Camron Rust

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

You "said nothing about how much ground the thrower can cover"? What does, "there is not a lot of room for lateral movement on a spot throwin", mean? There is a lot of room for lateral movement on a spot throwin, anywhere from about seven feet for a shorter player, to about twelve, or thirteen feet, for a player like Manute Bol, as was pointed out by Camron Rust

Billy, I've already clarified. If they're sliding, that trail foot needs to stay over the spot, and seriously, how many times to do you see a player stretch to one side while keeping the trail foot over the spot? It would put the thrower into such an awkward position.

My point on my original post was that the spot really isn't as big as some people make it out to be. It's obvious that I know only one foot has to be over the spot, especially after I clarified. Otherwise, a player like M. Bol wouldn't be able to stand normally; I'm sure his normal stance covers more than three feet.

Again, just to clarify redundantly: I was pointing out, following up on the OPs statement that it may not have been a violation, that the spot is pretty small and the player doesn't have to move very far to violate.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

If they're sliding, that trail foot needs to stay over the spot, and seriously, how many times to do you see a player stretch to one side while keeping the trail foot over the spot? It would put the thrower into such an awkward position.

I'm not really talking about stretching, and I apologize if I implied that. When I was a player, I was coached, and when I was a coach, I coached my players to step into their pass, be it a chest pass, a bounce pass. You're right about Manute Bol possibly taking more than three lateral feet just standing out of bounds holding the ball in his normal stance, which is probably why the rule is written the way it is, to allow inbounders, especially those with some unobstructed depth behind them, to take a normal step toward where they intend their pass to go. Maybe Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. can tell us more about Dr. Naismith's intent with this rule, since we can't ask the good doctor himself, may he rest in peace, if it's possible for his soul to rest in peace during the month of March?