You make the call - newbies especially invited to participate

[referee99]

Originally Posted by jeschmit

I would say it isn't a BC violation as he still has the right to be in the BC since both of his feet still obtain some of the backcourt floor. I'm thinking of this in terms of what if he started dribbling and moved into the BC and thus removed his big feed from the division line. I would not call a violation then, so I would not call a violation if he passed the ball back without dribbling.

Is there a trick answer to this? Because it seems like there might be...

You're right. I would suggest he is IN the backcourt. Period.

[deecee]

Julie,

he added to the stitch that what if the same player then began to dribble but both his feet ended up in the FC and the ball remained in the BC.

[AKOFL]

Originally Posted by deecee

all 3 points were also in the backcourt.

Preety much what I was getting at. Three points applies to dribbling, but it you catch the ball with both feet in the front court, the third point ( the ball) now has front court status. Still three points.

[deecee]

I dont get what you are saying -- because the feet were NOT in the frontcourt.

[Amesman]

Originally Posted by Amesman

Did either of them hit the ball with her pigtails?

No.

Not to digress too much, but now what if Mr. Big Feet catches the pass and starts dribbling parallel to the division line, feet in the forecourt, ball bouncing up and down in the backcourt/on the line? (Almost kind of reminds of the old one: Can you tell me if my turn signal is working? OK -- yes, no, yes, no ...)

To clarify my question a bit here, we have the same sitch as Mark posed in the OP (ball caught with feet on division line) and dribble starts.

BUT then player dribbles parallel to division line -- feet in forecourt but ball bouncing in back court. Does he establish himself in forecourt when the ball leaves the backcourt floor on a dribble? Or is he still backcourt until the ball is actually bounced in the forecourt?

What if he's dribbling like that and simply picks up his dribble -- still never having had it land in the forecourt -- does that change your answer?

[mbyron]

Suppose player catches ball with a foot in BC and begins to dribble. Now the "3-point" part of the rule goes in to effect: he's a dribbler in the BC, so both feet and the ball must be in FC for him to have FC status.

Put the point differently: if a player catches the ball, then the ball has the same status as the player (BC in your question). The ball can gain FC status without a dribble, if, for instance, a player is straddling the line and pivots into the FC (even just picking up the BC foot would do it). If a player with BC status begins to dribble with the ball or either foot in the BC, the ball still has BC status.

Keep the 10-second BC count going during all of the action you describe.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Amesman

To clarify my question a bit here, we have the same sitch as Mark posed in the OP (ball caught with feet on division line) and dribble starts.

BUT then player dribbles parallel to division line -- feet in forecourt but ball bouncing in back court. Does he establish himself in forecourt when the ball leaves the backcourt floor on a dribble? Or is he still backcourt until the ball is actually bounced in the forecourt?

What if he's dribbling like that and simply picks up his dribble -- still never having had it land in the forecourt -- does that change your answer?

If his feet are on the division line when he starts dribbling, then the 3 point guideline is in play. If his feet were in the FC when he caught the ball, 3 points do not matter.

Now, let's say he starts dribbling with his feet on the line and the ball bouncing in the BC. While dribbling, he moves his feet to the FC but the ball continues bouncing in the BC. Once he picks up his dribble, he has ended the three points issue, and now has FC status.

[Juulie Downs]

Originally Posted by Amesman

To clarify my question a bit here, we have the same sitch as Mark posed in the OP (ball caught with feet on division line) and dribble starts.

BUT then player dribbles parallel to division line -- feet in forecourt but ball bouncing in back court. Does he establish himself in forecourt when the ball leaves the backcourt floor on a dribble? Or is he still backcourt until the ball is actually bounced in the forecourt?

What if he's dribbling like that and simply picks up his dribble -- still never having had it land in the forecourt -- does that change your answer?

Ah, I see now. I didn't realize you were saying that he caught the ball with feet on the division line as in the OP. Deecee is correct,then. Three points applies.

[Amesman]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Now, let's say he starts dribbling with his feet on the line and the ball bouncing in the BC. While dribbling, he moves his feet to the FC but the ball continues bouncing in the BC. Once he picks up his dribble, he has ended the three points issue, and now has FC status.

THAT is the scenario I was (so pathetically) trying to describe. Thanks

[Scratch85]

The division line is in the backcourt. I know this doesn't really apply to the OP, but since b/c violations are commonly confusing, I thought it would be good to think this out before we get on the court.

[NewUmpinCT]

I believe the answer is no. The ball and both feet never totally entered into the front court. Play continues, nothing called.

[swkansasref33]

no. the rule states that the offensive player must establish himself in front court-all three points- ball, both feet, before he is in the front court. this is not a violation

[Adam]

Originally Posted by swkansasref33

no. the rule states that the offensive player must establish himself in front court-all three points- ball, both feet, before he is in the front court. this is not a violation

Which situation are you referring to?

[swkansasref33]

the op

[Adam]

Originally Posted by swkansasref33

the op

Then the "3 points" rule is not relevant. The player in the OP is not dribbling.