Automatic T?

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I did not say you overlooked it. I said it might not warrant a T. There are other ways to get players and coaches to stop behavior without calling a T. I do it all the time and it works most of the time without anyone noticing there was a problem in the first place.

Peace

If a kid says "No way" and slams the ball on the floor so that it bounces 15 feet high, it warrants a T. I think people would notice this problem.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by just another ref

If a kid says "No way" and slams the ball on the floor so that it bounces 15 feet high, it warrants a T. I think people would notice this problem.

I do not know about you, but I do not sit around the court with a measuring tape to know if the ball went 15 feet (which is hyperbole on some level) or 8 feet.

In the NCAA Finals, the ball went higher than 10 feet if you judge the ball going over the rim and nothing was called. And the officials were commended by many officiating observers for understanding the situation.

Also I would like to talk to the officials to know if they heard or did not hear the kid said. Once again, there is a reason they passed on a T and I frankly do not like taking the words of only one person that may or may not have been in a position to see or understand what the officials were doing or what they were not doing. And that is most of all why I like to stay away from the "automatic T" stuff.

Peace

[mbyron]

2 scenarios:

(a) Kid gets called for a foul, he's obviously unhappy with the call, slams ball down, it bounces 15 feet high, he walks away. This earns a T from me.

(b) Close game, kid gets called for a foul, he knows he committed a dumb foul, he says "C'mon Smith!" (which is his name), he slams the ball down harder than he means to, he gets this "uh oh" look on his face, retrieves the ball and hands it to me. Probably no T here from me.

I suspect that (a) happens far more often than (b), but I agree with the general principle that technical fouls are almost never "automatic" but sometimes obvious and easy to call.

[Back In The Saddle]

Assuming that it happened just as the OP said, including the height of the bounce, I'm almost certain to have a T. It's just business. If another official chooses to handle it differently during his game, fair enough.

Coach Bill, there's no way we can pass judgment on why the officials in your game didn't T the kid for this. Without even trying I can rattle off half a dozen reasons why they might not have called it. Not the least of which is that they didn't see the situation the same way you did.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by mbyron

2 scenariosa) Kid gets called for a foul, he's obviously unhappy with the call, slams ball down, it bounces 15 feet high, he walks away. This earns a T from me.(b) Close game, kid gets called for a foul, he knows he committed a dumb foul, he says "C'mon Smith!" (which is his name), he slams the ball down harder than he means to, he gets this "uh oh" look on his face, retrieves the ball and hands it to me. Probably no T here from me.I suspect that (a) happens far more often than (b), but I agree with the general principle that technical fouls are almost never "automatic" but sometimes obvious and easy to call.

This sounds a lot like like a common sense. How dare you bring common sense into a discussion about NFHS basketball rules.

[Coach Bill]

Originally Posted by mbyron

2 scenarios:

(a) Kid gets called for a foul, he's obviously unhappy with the call, slams ball down, it bounces 15 feet high, he walks away. This earns a T from me.

(b) Close game, kid gets called for a foul, he knows he committed a dumb foul, he says "C'mon Smith!" (which is his name), he slams the ball down harder than he means to, he gets this "uh oh" look on his face, retrieves the ball and hands it to me. Probably no T here from me.

I suspect that (a) happens far more often than (b), but I agree with the general principle that technical fouls are almost never "automatic" but sometimes obvious and easy to call.

That is what I was trying to explain is that it was (a) in my case, and I've always seen a T called in that situation. But, there may have been mitigating circumstances that I was not privy to. I didn't push it. Made my comment, got my dirty look, and moved on.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Coach Bill

That is what I was trying to explain is that it was (a) in my case, and I've always seen a T called in that situation. But, there may have been mitigating circumstances that I was not privy to. I didn't push it. Made my comment, got my dirty look, and moved on.

If only I could learn to do this with my wife....

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Coach Bill

That is what I was trying to explain is that it was (a) in my case, and I've always seen a T called in that situation.

Well you did not always see a T, because it did not happen in this case.

Peace

[doubleringer]

I'm getting in on this late, but I agree with everyone here that there is no such thing as an "automatic" call. Sure, the OP sounds like something that would warrant a T from most of us, but we weren't on the game. It sounds like you did the right thing in letting it go after one comment. Hopefully you also used it as an example to teach your players that it was an inappropriate action on the floor.

The post reminded me of a lower level coach I used to love working with. I bet he saved his players 5 or more technicals in the few years I worked his teams. His players would begin to do something unsporting, complaining or the like, and before I could get the whislte in my mouth, he'd be yelling at them and have a sub at the bench. If the coach is taking care of it, especially at the lower levels, I'm happy to let them.

[icallfouls]

Official threw a flag on UW player for tossing a ball behind his head and up into the air. The end result, UW missed the 35 yd PAT and the official was killed by ESPN. The PAC 10 assignor had to come out and say it was AUTOMATIC.

Automatic calls are the bane of the game. They are a result of fanboys, coaches, and media who video every play and break them down. Then they get out their rulebooks and make interpretations for the officials about the calls that were or were not made. The result is due to pressure we are asked to call certain AUTOMATICs that are handed out during the season or in the next season.

It is required that the context of the game be considered when calling a game.

More and more we are being asked to call the game in black and white, when basketball is more gray. The use of automatics will result in a game that is played at the FT line. Its bad enough that the bigs are being taken out of the game and that the emphasis is on guard play.

Please people, let common sense prevail, don't take the spontaneity of the game away from this great game.