Foul Definition Help

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by referee99

Made the mistake of doing some reading of the rules book last night.

4-19

Art. 1... A personal foul is a player foul which involves illegal contact with an opponent while the ball is live, which hinders an opponent from performing normal defensive and offensive movements. A personal foul also includes contact by or on an airborne shooter when the ball is dead.

Note: Contact after the ball has become dead is ignored unless it is ruled intentional or flagrant or is committed by or on an airborne shooter.

The only situation where I can imagine a dead ball foul on an airborne shooter is on a dunk or maybe a tip, and the note suggests ignoring the contact unless flagrant or intentional.

Why d'ya suppose the 'or on' is included in the definition?

I think you're misreading the note part -- contact on an airborne shooter after the ball is dead (and, yes, it would likley be part of a dunk) does NOT need to be intentional or flagrant to be a foul

[referee99]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

I think you're misreading the note part -- contact on an airborne shooter after the ball is dead (and, yes, it would likley be part of a dunk) does NOT need to be intentional or flagrant to be a foul

Bob,

you are 100% correct.
ha, i had just crafted a 'no i'm not misunderstanding the note' reply... was just reading it before posting.... and my comprehender finally kicked in.

Dunker A1 (airborne shooter) throws down and is then fouled by B2:
Count the basket. A1 gets a free-throw. Even though A1 was fouled during a dead ball. Perfect.

tjones1 - Thanks for the touchback! I can't say that I've encountered that particular sitch in my young officiating career. Although I would've waved off the bucket, I doubt that I would've cleared the lane for the FTs. But it makes sense.

Now I own that play when/if it ever comes about. And I didn't even have to learn by making the mistake in a live game situation

I love this place!

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by referee99

Bob,

you are 100% correct.
ha, i had just crafted a 'no i'm not misunderstanding the note' reply... was just reading it before posting.... and my comprehender finally kicked in.

Dunker A1 (airborne shooter) throws down and is then fouled by B2:
Count the basket. A1 gets a free-throw. Even though A1 was fouled during a dead ball. Perfect.

Here's another such situation:
Wrong ruling even back then!