college goaltending question

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Johnny, post #17 was intended to answer your question. The answer is yes, it can be touched and NOT be goaltending as long as the ball is still on its way up. This is also true in the NCAA. However, the NBA rule is different.

This is so incomplete it qualifies as just plain wrong.

[Nevadaref]

Should I have said, "as long as the ball is not on its way down," Dan?

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Should I have said, "as long as the ball is not on its way down," Dan?

...and it has a chance to go in and it's not in the cylinder and it's above the rim.

In the context of this thread your answer says the ball can be blocked off the glass only if it's on the way up.

[Nevadaref]

Ok, after putting on my hyper-technical hat, I see what you are saying.
I took Johnny's question to be that he desired to know if it was legal to block a shot that had already hit the backboard, was still above the level of the ring, was not in the cylinder, and had a chance to go in.
I simply replied that as long as the ball was still on the way up, then this is a legal block per the Simplified & Illustrated reference that I already cited.

In otherwords, I took all of the other criteria as given. In the context of his question, I was not dealing with a ball that strikes the backboard, but is below the level or the ring, or has no chance to enter the basket, or is in the cylinder.

Of course, to answer the general case, you are correct to point out that all of those other factors need to be considered.

That's what I get for thinking that Johnny asked a relatively straightforward question. Perhaps I read to much into it, but I believe that he was seeking an answer for a very specific case.

We'll just have to wait and let him clarify. Hopefully, we've both helped him to understand this better.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Ok, after putting on my hyper-technical hat, I see what you are saying.

Yeah, fwiw it pisses me off too, Nevada, when Dan goes all hyper-technical on us like that.

[Johnny Ringo]

So, it all boils down to: was the ball in it's downward flight - no matter if it hit the backboard or not. If the try is in it's downward flight and has a chance to go in - it is golatending. The hitting the backboard really has nothing to do with it.

[MJT]

Originally Posted by Johnny Ringo

So, it all boils down to: was the ball in it's downward flight - no matter if it hit the backboard or not. If the try is in it's downward flight and has a chance to go in - it is golatending. The hitting the backboard really has nothing to do with it.

That is correct.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Johnny Ringo

So, it all boils down to: was the ball in it's downward flight - no matter if it hit the backboard or not. If the try is in it's downward flight and has a chance to go in - it is golatending. The hitting the backboard really has nothing to do with it.

1. Ball completely above the rim.

2. Ball on downward flight.

3. Ball has a chance to go in.

If any of these things do not apply, you cannot have goaltending. You notice hitting the backboard is not apart of this equation.

Peace

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

I took all of the other criteria as given. In the context of his question, I was not dealing with a ball that strikes the backboard, but is below the level or the ring, or has no chance to enter the basket, or is in the cylinder.

Of course, to answer the general case, you are correct to point out that all of those other factors need to be considered.

No, they don't. If the try is on its upward flight, then it's not goaltending, period. You don't need to consider anything else. Because in order for it to be goaltending, it MUST be on it's downward flight. Therefore, if it's going up, then it's not goaltending. It might be 100 other things, but it's not GT. Nevadaref's answer was absolutely correct as stated. As long as the try is going up, it's not goaltending to touch it.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

No, they don't. If the try is on its upward flight, then it's not goaltending, period. You don't need to consider anything else. Because in order for it to be goaltending, it MUST be on it's downward flight. Therefore, if it's going up, then it's not goaltending. It might be 100 other things, but it's not GT. Nevadaref's answer was absolutely correct as stated. As long as the try is going up, it's not goaltending to touch it.

No. The question was can the ball be blocked off the glass legally. It was such a good question Johnny Ringo asked it twice. Nevada's answer directly addressed Johnny Ringo and he said "The answer is yes, it can be touched and NOT be goaltending as long as the ball is still on its way up."

In a vacuum Nevada's answer is correct. In regard to how the backboard comes into play in this rule he is wrong. The backboard has nothing to do with GT, whether the ball is going up, down or levitating in mid air.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

In a vacuum Nevada's answer is correct.

In a vacuum or out of it. If the ball is going up, no goaltending, regardless of anything else (with the one exception of goaltending a free throw). The backboard is irrelevent, as you point out, but that doesn't make Nevada's statement "so incomplete as to be just plain wrong". It's entirely correct. It just doesn't address the further misunderstanding about the backboard.

I understand your point, but I don't want some newbie to come along and see the following exchange:

OP: Is it goaltending to block the shot off the backboard if it's still on the way up.
Nevada: It's never goaltending to hit the try on the way up.
Dan: That's incomplete and incorrect.

Yikes! That gives a very bad impression of the actual rule. I know what you were getting at and you're right that Nevadaref's answer doesn't address the point that the backboard has nothing to do with goaltending or basket interference. But it is equally true that it's never goaltending to touch the try on its upward flight (unless it's a free throw).