substitute or not

[Zoochy]

JR,
This is the best discussion site so far. To all, keep up the good work!

[OHBBREF]

So what we are saying here is that even though the player is in the game and becomes legal - when the ball becomes live - then if you take him out and bring him back now you can penalize for the illegal jersey?

There is no provision in the NCAA book that covers you either way if he goes out of the game and comes back in that I can find and I believe that once they are legal you can not make them illegal again.

Only one technical can be issued even if I send four people in the game with illegal jerseys, - so if I take them out of the game later and bring them back in you are going to issue another technical for one or all who enter again?

This seems to defy logic.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by OHBBREF

There is no provision in the NCAA book that covers you either way if he goes out of the game and comes back in that I can find and I believe that once they are legal you can not make them illegal again.

I don't think this is right. NCAA 10-12a says that you penalize "offender" with a single indirect technical foul whenever discovered before the ball becomes live. So if he goes out, and then comes in again, you can penalize it before the ball becomes live. However 10-12b says that if multiple players have illegal jerseys, it is penalized with a single indirect technical foul.

Which brings us to. . .

Only one technical can be issued even if I send four people in the game with illegal jerseys, - so if I take them out of the game later and bring them back in you are going to issue another technical for one or all who enter again?

This is true for NCAA, as I just pointed out. But in high school, I don't think this is true. Uniform technicals are listed under 10-3 in the NFHS book -- those are PLAYER technicals. The case plays in 3.4 seem to indicate that each shirt is penalized.

You can only be penalized once if you have to change the scorebook to match the numbers of several players. But that's different from the jersey actually being illegal.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

The case plays in 3.4 seem to indicate that each shirt is penalized.

NFHS rule 10-3-2PENALTY says that each illegal shirt is penalized one time if discovered prior to the ball bevoming live....

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by OHBBREF

This seems to defy logic.

It might defy logic, but it doesn't defy NFHS rules.

[OHBBREF]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

It might defy logic, but it doesn't defy NFHS rules.

So NFHS rules defy logic?

[OHBBREF]

I will conceed the NFHS ruling of each shirt being penalized but it is only penalized one time.
So in other words they can buy their way in for the rest of the game with a technical.

But I still have a problem with the player who became legal being given a Tech later in the game however I can see where it could be interpreted that way.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by OHBBREF

So NFHS rules defy logic?

Rules like allowing a head coach to call a TO do.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by OHBBREF

I will conceed the NFHS ruling of each shirt being penalized but it is only penalized one time.
So in other words they can buy their way in for the rest of the game with a technical.

I would agree with that!

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by OHBBREF

I will conceed the NFHS ruling of each shirt being penalized but it is only penalized one time.
So in other words they can buy their way in for the rest of the game with a technical.

But I still have a problem with the player who became legal being given a Tech later in the game however I can see where it could be interpreted that way.

THe case is clear -- there's no other way to interpret it.

Now, has anyone enforced it? Would you?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Now, has anyone enforced it? Would you?

No and no.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

No and no.

Ditto and ditto.

[Zoochy]

Back when the numbers 1 and 2 were illegal, I handed out T's for illegal shirt. One was like the original post. I noticed the illegal number when the player commited a foul. I made mention of the situation to my partner, then we got both coaches together an explained the situation. No Tech at that time, but when the player reentered after being replaced then the T was applied.
Also, during warm-ups, of a different game, I noticed an illegal number. Got my partner and both coaches together. Talked about the situation. Since no other uniforms were available, they agreed to let the player play without applying a 'T'.