The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Basketball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 08:06am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Winchester, NH
Posts: 184
Penalty for Delay

Officials warn Team A for delay for interfering with the ball after a goal. Later, Team A delays by not having the court ready to play following a time-out. Officials should assess a Team Technical for the second instance of delay. However, the officials (for whatever reason that I understand should be prevented) do not realize it is the second delay by Team A. From reading Rule 10-1, I assume that the officials must assess the technical at the time the second infraction occurs. Do I assume correctly, or can the penalty be assessed when it is discovered? If officials must assess the penalty at the time of the infraction, when does the time to assess the penalty expire?
__________________
Insert cool signature line here!
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 08:34am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 17,321
My opinion: Once the ball has become live, the game is not being delayed. It's then too late to assess the penalty for delay.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 09:12am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 277
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins
My opinion: Once the ball has become live, the game is not being delayed. It's then too late to assess the penalty for delay.
YaBut, what if the delays are reported to the table properly, and at the half someone tells you not to forget that Team A has a delay for X and a second delay for Y so another delay for one of those things is a T?
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 09:12am
Courageous When Prudent
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Posts: 13,814
Question never answered in the 5 years I've been a ref...

1st quarter: B2 reaches across the plane during throw-in and
  • a) fouls A1 and intentional foul is called
  • b) touches the ball and technical foul is called.

So far everything is good. Later in the same game....
  • 3rd quarter: B2 reaches across the plane but neither touches the ball nor A1.
Would this be the first warning for delay or would situations a and/or b above also have counted towards the warning limit?
__________________
A-hole formerly known as BNR

Last edited by Raymond; Wed Oct 18, 2006 at 09:50am.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 09:23am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Champaign, IL
Posts: 5,687
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins
My opinion: Once the ball has become live, the game is not being delayed. It's then too late to assess the penalty for delay.
I agree with Bob. (I've been doing that a lot recently...)

It's not a correctable error situation, so those rules and time limits wouldn't apply.

What if a coach calls you a cheatin' SOB, and, for whatever reason, you decide to think about it for a play or two. Then, after play goes up and down the court, you decide the comment was false and it really was unsportsmanlike. Do you issue the T then?

The play, and the time to make the call is past, so we move on.
__________________
M&M's - The Official Candy of the Department of Redundancy Department.

(Used with permission.)
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 09:23am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Western Mass.
Posts: 9,104
Send a message via AIM to ChuckElias
BNR, in both (a) and (b) part of the penalty is a warning for delay.
__________________
Any NCAA rules and interpretations in this post are relevant for men's games only!
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 09:24am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Western Mass.
Posts: 9,104
Send a message via AIM to ChuckElias
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins
My opinion: Once the ball has become live, the game is not being delayed. It's then too late to assess the penalty for delay.
Assuming that the water is cleaned up at that point, I agree. If you put the ball in play, but then get to the front court and find water still on the court, could you stop the game, direct the team to clean it up and also issue the delay warning (or T)?
__________________
Any NCAA rules and interpretations in this post are relevant for men's games only!
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 09:25am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 17,321
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChuckElias
BNR, in both (a) and (b) part of the penalty is a warning for delay.
And, the T in (b) is charged to the player.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 09:48am
Courageous When Prudent
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Posts: 13,814
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins
And, the T in (b) is charged to the player.
My bad Bob, I knew that. I had a brain freeze.
__________________
A-hole formerly known as BNR
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 01:09pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Frisco (Dallas), Texas
Posts: 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by M&M Guy
I agree with Bob. (I've been doing that a lot recently...)

It's not a correctable error situation, so those rules and time limits wouldn't apply.

What if a coach calls you a cheatin' SOB, and, for whatever reason, you decide to think about it for a play or two. Then, after play goes up and down the court, you decide the comment was false and it really was unsportsmanlike. Do you issue the T then?

The play, and the time to make the call is past, so we move on.
Why is this not a Correctable Error. 2-10-1

Officials may correct an error if a rule is inadvertently set aside and results in:
a. Failure to award a merited free throw.

You've called the second delay which should have resulted in a merited free throw that you did not award. As long as the error is caught during the first dead ball before the clock has properly started, shouldn't this be a correctable error.

If not, why not.
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 01:22pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: CA
Posts: 259
If you call the T after the ball is live, and go back and issue a T, then the official is delaying the game. Let it go and keep the game going. Our primary responsilbity is to make sure the game flows.
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 01:27pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Frisco (Dallas), Texas
Posts: 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mwanr1
If you call the T after the ball is live, and go back and issue a T, then the official is delaying the game. Let it go and keep the game going. Our primary responsilbity is to make sure the game flows.
Then why do we have Correctable Errors in the first place?
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 01:32pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Houston
Posts: 572
Mr. Jenkins:

And, the T in (b) is charged to the player.

Please check whether the technical for delay is charged to the player. I believe it's a Team technical, and the individual does not get charged. I don't have my book with me, and we had this happen in the first half of a game. We charged the player with a technical, but told the coaches we would check the rule book at half time. We checked, and if I remember correctly, we removed the T from the individual player.
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 01:37pm
Courageous When Prudent
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Posts: 13,814
Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankHtown
Mr. Jenkins:

And, the T in (b) is charged to the player.

Please check whether the technical for delay is charged to the player. I believe it's a Team technical, and the individual does not get charged. I don't have my book with me, and we had this happen in the first half of a game. We charged the player with a technical, but told the coaches we would check the rule book at half time. We checked, and if I remember correctly, we removed the T from the individual player.
If the player touches the ball the "T" is charged to the player, if the "T" is for delay of game it is charged as a Team Technical.
__________________
A-hole formerly known as BNR
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Wed Oct 18, 2006, 01:46pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Winchester, NH
Posts: 184
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kajun Ref N Texas
Then why do we have Correctable Errors in the first place?
I think the issue is the time limit to make the ruling. The Correctable error rule addresses limitations on the time limits to assess the penalties or correct an improperly executed penalty.
__________________
Insert cool signature line here!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Delay on B? dumbref Football 17 Sat Oct 29, 2005 01:13pm
warning for delay! jritchie Basketball 4 Fri Oct 21, 2005 04:48am
Delay T Dan_ref Basketball 7 Sun Feb 01, 2004 07:53am
Thrower in delay...... Jeremy Hohn Basketball 7 Tue Nov 19, 2002 02:28am
Delay after TO physicsref Basketball 26 Thu Dec 06, 2001 09:21pm


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:37pm.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1