Should I have been the hard-***?

[Back In The Saddle]

5th game in row this past Saturday, final games of a 3 day tourney. I get a new partner for this game, and I wish I hadn't. Just to set the scene:

• In pre-game he was so busy chatting with the player who was keeping score (the son of one of our local board members, coincidence?), that he will barely acknowledge my presence, let alone engage in any kind of pre-game. I have to ask him his name.
• Reacts to criticism from the crowd by talking back, several times. He offers people the opportunity to come do it better and even threatens to call the game.

After all this, during one timeout I'm holding the ball and he asks me for it so he can shoot around. I ask him quietly, "What, you don't think we've got enough problems already tonight?" He looks at me like he has no idea what I'm talking about. So I toss him the ball and walk away.

At the time I was mentally chanting Mick's mantra: Get in, get done, get out.

Today I'm wondering, as a matter of professionalism or just general principle, if I should have (a) kept the ball and walked away, and/or (b) gotten in this guy's grill about his behavior.

What would you have done? What if it were a regular season game, rather than a summer tourney?

[BktBallRef]

Screw'em. Eat his arse out. He's got it coming.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Screw'em. Eat his arse out. He's got it coming.

Not your place to chew him out, but it is your place to tell the assignor of this particular event not to ever team you with person again. That would probably a better way to get your message across.

[Ref_ Fred]

Not your place to chew him out, but it is your place to tell the assignor of this particular event not to ever team you with person again. That would probably a better way to get your message across.

Asking to not officiate with him again, is just pushing the problem on someone else and not dealing with him. remember when on the court you are a team. If he screws up, you both screw up. So deal with it right then and there. He'll see how much of an unprofessional person he is. Although you have to do it with professionalism.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Ref_ Fred

Asking to not officiate with him again, is just pushing the problem on someone else and not dealing with him. remember when on the court you are a team. If he screws up, you both screw up. So deal with it right then and there. He'll see how much of an unprofessional person he is. Although you have to do it with professionalism.

Fred, didya ever think that BITS' assignor might not really want BITS to deal personally with the guy? The guy is the assignor's problem, not BITS'.

Problems like this are the assignor's problem imo. He has to know what's going on, and then it's up to him to deal with the guy. There's a good chance that the assignor may already know what's going on; most assignors aren't that disconnected from the people that they're using. The assignor may need this goofus as a body just to fill out game assignments in these summer AAU-type tournaments, but doesn't really have any plans at all to use him in any meaningful games.

I think that BITS probably handled it the best way for a summer situation. Get in, get done and get out. However, I think that the assignor should still get notified.

In a regular season game however, there's nowayinhell that he's gonna practise his shooting during TO's- I'd break his wrists first.

[ChuckElias]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

I think that BITS probably handled it the best way for a summer situation. Get in, get done and get out. However, I think that the assignor should still get notified.

In a regular season game however, there's nowayinhell that he's gonna practise his shooting during TO's- I'd break his wrists first.

Ditto. Especially the underlined part.

[Ref_ Fred]

I agree with you guys. that the assignor should handle it, but given the fact that it is summer league I would still give a piece to think about ..

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by Ref_ Fred

I agree with you guys. that the assignor should handle it, but given the fact that it is summer league I would still give a piece to think about ..

Fred, ask yourself this question: "If I start reaming this guy right now, will it make things any better?" Since the answer is probably "No", then why do it?

Now after the game, when you're out in the parking lot or in the hallway away from everyone else, then a quiet conversation about his professionalism and how it made things way harder than they had to be - that might be in order...but not giving him the ball, chewing him out in front of fans - that's not being a harda$$, that's just being an a$$hole...

[Ref_ Fred]

He'll see how much of an unprofessional person he is. Although you have to do it with professionalism.

This is what I stated earlier. doing it with professionalism. After the game is when I would ream him a new A$$hole...

And I thank you for you kind thoughts RockyRoad.

[stripes]

Ray,

You know that most assignors around here (for summer ball) are mostly concerned with getting the games covered. If a warm body will show up, they are ok. That being said, I would call the assignor and let him know what went on. If I were assigning, I'd want to know.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Not your place to chew him out, but it is your place to tell the assignor of this particular event not to ever team you with person again. That would probably a better way to get your message across.

Why? So he can do the same thing with other officials, who don't have the 'nads to stand up to him? This obviously isn't the first time his stupidity has shown. Ignoring it and hoping it goes away accomplishes nothing.

On the floor, we're a team. If he's working with me and making us both look badly, you can bet your butt we're going to go somehwere private and have a discussion. He'll understand that I'm not going to put up with it. He's my problem when he's on the floor with me.

[Ref_ Fred]

On the floor, we're a team. If he's working with me and making us both look badly, you can bet your butt we're going to go somehwere private and have a discussion. He'll understand that I'm not going to put up with it. He's my problem when he's on the floor with me.

BktBallRef, well said. He is making both of us look bad. When the game is over any comments will reflect "it's those ref's, not that ref"..

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

What would you have done? What if it were a regular season game, rather than a summer tourney?

It was a summer league game; I would not give a rat's ***. I do not expect all the procedures to be followed during the summer when everything is so informal. I cannot think of a time where I had a "pre-game" with an official during the summer.

Unless the guy threaten a fan or cursed out a player, I would not contact the assignor at all. Once again it is summer league. If anything happen that was so bad, it is not like I will be necessarily working with this guy during the regular season.

If this was the regular season, I would likely say something to him or the assignor. I do not like to say things to an assignor unless I am asked directly about what took place by that assignor or events were reported to them with my knowledge.

Peace

[truerookie]

Back in the Saddle,
I can understand your view point. I take the summer time to continue my transition from U2 to U1 (meaning working on my officiating). I would have asked him a question like. What part of officiating are you working on to improve during the summer? If the light bulb does not come on, I know then this is a warm body to fill games. My two cents

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Why? So he can do the same thing with other officials, who don't have the 'nads to stand up to him? This obviously isn't the first time his stupidity has shown. Ignoring it and hoping it goes away accomplishes nothing.

On the floor, we're a team. If he's working with me and making us both look badly, you can bet your butt we're going to go somehwere private and have a discussion. He'll understand that I'm not going to put up with it. He's my problem when he's on the floor with me.

Really??? And you are assuming that he gives a rat's @$$ what his partner thinks? Based on the type of behavior he is already exhibiting I'm thinking he's really not too much concerned about what his partner thinks. It may just be me but I'm thinking that the assignor chewing him out or the assignor not giving him anymore games carries a lot more punch than "joe blow" referee partner jumping in his butt.

You say

He'll understand that I'm not going to put up with it. He's my problem when he's on the floor with me.

Now what are you going to do to enforce your stance with him? He might just tell you "thanks for your opinion but I'm fine with what I'm doing." (or maybe he'll just say "F*** off")." Now what do you do?