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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Thu Jan 12, 2006, 01:58pm
Huck Finn
 
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Location: Las Vegas
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There is a scramble for the ball after a shot. A player secures the ball and calls timeout immediately. The official grants it immediately. The shot clock says 35. What do you do?

A. Leave the shot clock alone

B. Set it to 34 because a second MUST come off since they controlled the ball.

Another lovely situation I had in a game. I will wait and then say what side of this "disagreement" I was on.
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Old Thu Jan 12, 2006, 02:12pm
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If I saw that the shot clock had been reset correctly when A1 grabbed the ball and then was re-set again when TO was called, I would reset it to what I saw before the TO.

If I didn't see the shot clock reset after the granting of the TO, I would not put it at 34 and tell the coach (if asked), that the TO was granted so quickly that the timer simply didn't have time to reset. I don't think you can definitively say that a second had to come off. Could've been less.
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old Thu Jan 12, 2006, 02:23pm
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I would have left it alone.

Z
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old Thu Jan 12, 2006, 03:43pm
Huck Finn
 
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Of course, my partner said the clock HAD to go to 34. I told him it didn't. His only reasoning was what someone else told him. He didn't have any definite knowledge, he just thought it had to be done no matter what.

This was not a good situation. I feel sorry for the teams because this was a close game and there were other things that happened.
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old Thu Nov 30, 2006, 10:24am
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This is an older thread but I have the exact same question.

When the shot clock is reset it is reset to 35.0. It doesn't show 34 until it hits 34.0.

Showing Actual
35 35.0
35 34.9
35 34.8

35 34.2
35 34.1
34 34.0

1 0.2
1 0.1
0 0.0

This means that the shot clock can show 35 but that in reality it is at 34.(something). If the shot clock is reset to 34.0 then you have now taken time away from the team in control.

Is their an interpretation or a case play that describes this situation? I've heard from a number of knowledgeable sources that you have to reset the clock to 34, but I just can't agree with that based on my above argument. Please set me straight if I am wrong.
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old Thu Nov 30, 2006, 12:15pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomegun
Of course, my partner said the clock HAD to go to 34. I told him it didn't. His only reasoning was what someone else told him.
Very typical: "Somebody told me that, but I don't remember who".

Variation: "[Name] told that during a meeting some years ago". ([Name] stands for an instructor, assignor o colleague who is not present at the moment.)

Second variation: "It is in the rule book or in the case book, at the moment I can't find where; maybe some interpretation I read in the net."

I have said many things which are not in the rule book, according to some young officials; of course I have never said those things.

I remember very well that many years ago, I was very young, a coach told me about an error I made and he was right, while I insisted that the rule book said differently. Since then I try not to be caught unprepared.

Ciao
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Old Thu Nov 30, 2006, 01:08pm
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Where's Chuck when I need him

Maybe we could collect money from everyone and hire him back. (Of course as a seperate screen name) We could stand in front of Kroger next to the Salvation Army volunteers and blow our whistles instead of ringing bells.
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old Thu Nov 30, 2006, 04:37pm
(Something hilarious)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by All_Heart
This is an older thread but I have the exact same question.

When the shot clock is reset it is reset to 35.0. It doesn't show 34 until it hits 34.0.

Showing Actual
35 35.0
35 34.9
35 34.8

35 34.2
35 34.1
34 34.0

1 0.2
1 0.1
0 0.0

This means that the shot clock can show 35 but that in reality it is at 34.(something). If the shot clock is reset to 34.0 then you have now taken time away from the team in control.

Is their an interpretation or a case play that describes this situation? I've heard from a number of knowledgeable sources that you have to reset the clock to 34, but I just can't agree with that based on my above argument. Please set me straight if I am wrong.
I'm no expert, as I'm only in my second year of using a shot clock, but using your above logic, I agree. So unless the shotclock shows tenths of a second above 9.9 seconds (I don't think I've ever seen one that does this), I don't know why you'd change it to 34, when it's possible the clock was properly reset and stopped, and .9 or less seconds of time have elapsed.
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old Thu Nov 30, 2006, 05:59pm
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I also thought there was a one second delay in the electronics, timer pressing the stop button, etc. At 35 or 34 seconds, I'm not going to look for extra work to do. It's 35 coach. You get a fresh new 10 seconds to bring it up the court if backcourt to frontcourt. If it's stays in the FC, 35 seconds. Play ball. There is no way you could ever convince me that the game is going to come down to this one second. I'm not changing nothing.

I had a HS game where there was 2.1 seconds left after a OOB play to go in a one point game. The coach argued that the game clock should say 3.1 seconds. I told the coach there's a one second delay so there's the one second. Had he said 4.1 seconds, I could have put 3.1 seconds on the clock, but since he insisted that it should be 3.1. I had nothing to go back to the table with, plus I did not have definite knowledge cause I was watching to see which way my partner was going to go with the ball. Clock was secondary.
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Old Thu Nov 30, 2006, 07:13pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old School
The coach argued that the game clock should say 3.1 seconds. I told the coach there's a one second delay so there's the one second. Had he said 4.1 seconds, I could have put 3.1 seconds on the clock, but since he insisted that it should be 3.1.
First of all, I'm new here, but I've noted others' responses to your posts and have to say I agree - I don't think you're an official.

Two points on your original post, though:
1. You're gonna let a coach tell you what should be on the clock? "Had he said 4.1 seconds, I could have put 3.1 seconds on the clock..." WTH?

2. The rule regarding lag time has been eliminated. If you DID have definite knowledge of a time other than 2.1 seconds, you could have changed it to that exact time.
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  #11 (permalink)  
Old Thu Nov 30, 2006, 10:41pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdw3018
First of all, I'm new here, but I've noted others' responses to your posts and have to say I agree - I don't think you're an official.

Two points on your original post, though:
1. You're gonna let a coach tell you what should be on the clock? "Had he said 4.1 seconds, I could have put 3.1 seconds on the clock..." WTH?

2. The rule regarding lag time has been eliminated. If you DID have definite knowledge of a time other than 2.1 seconds, you could have changed it to that exact time.
The play happen 2 years ago. If I had definite knowledge I would have put it back on the clock, however, I stated very clearly that I didn't have definite knowledge. When the coach said one second different than what the actual time now reads. I told the coach there's a one second lag time. The coach needs to say at least 2 seconds different from the time or he leaves himself open to that interpretation from the official. The home team clock personnel and the home team coach is gonna yell and be right by rule, one second delay, you can't change, hence, this is probably why they remove this wording this year. My bet is it actually happened somewhere.

Don't be so quick to judge.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old Thu Nov 30, 2006, 11:36pm
Courageous When Prudent
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdw3018
First of all, I'm new here, but I've noted others' responses to your posts and have to say I agree - I don't think you're an official.
JMO, but I don't think anyone should waste their time with his/her posts.
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old Fri Dec 01, 2006, 08:35am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef
[size=30]...but I don't think anyone should waste their time with his/her posts.
I will say it like this. At camps I attended over the last 3 years. The camp directors would always say at the beginning of the camp. "You're going to get a lot of information during this camp. Take what makes since to you and use it if you can. That, that doesn't make since, don't use it." The same is true of discussion. If something is said that you don't agree with, than you don't have to read it, but what you should never do is disregard someone's else point of view based on someone else's prejudice. Judge life and the content of one's character for yourself and draw your own conclusions. Much the same way as you call a game. Call the game based on what you see, not on what the coach sees or what the fans see.

I am much like an official in a hostile crowd engaging this board. Notice how I am constantly attacked for what I call or say. Also notice how I stick to my point (or call) at hand and not let the crowd persuade me or get to me. I may not always be right, that is life, but I stick to my belief (my call).

Peace....
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old Fri Dec 01, 2006, 08:53am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old School
Also notice how I stick to my point (or call) at hand and not let the crowd persuade me or get to me. I may not always be right, that is life, but I stick to my belief (my call).
Stay the course, Old School, stay the course.
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old Fri Dec 01, 2006, 10:03am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old School
Also notice how I stick to my point (or call) at hand and not let the crowd persuade me or get to me. I may not always be right, that is life, but I stick to my belief (my call).
If your partner approached you with information that you kicked a rule would you change it or would you stick to your belief so that you don't look bad?

Quote:
I had a HS game where there was 2.1 seconds left after a OOB play to go in a one point game. The coach argued that the game clock should say 3.1 seconds. I told the coach there's a one second delay so there's the one second. Had he said 4.1 seconds, I could have put 3.1 seconds on the clock, but since he insisted that it should be 3.1.
You could not have put 3.1 seconds on the clock 2 years ago. You would have to put 4.1 seconds if you had definite knowledge that it ran down from 4.1 to 2.1.

Quote:
I was watching to see which way my partner was going to go with the ball. Clock was secondary.
Actually the clock should be your primary concern in this case. It takes only a split second to make sure that the clock is stopped and then you can find out where your partner is signaling the ball to go.
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