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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 03:26am
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6th Grade girls game, team A is clearly superior to team B and dominating the game. Coach A is a bit of a howler and makes chirpy comments to me and my partner, particularly early in the 2nd half, earning him an acknowledgement and a stop sign (after he acted like a child when he wanted a backcourt call when B1 is straddling the division line and never gained front court status). After my partner makes a foul call on team B early in the 4th, he rises and yells, "It's about time we finally get a call, we're getting mugged out there," earning him his 1st technical from me. I went through the formalities and reminded him of the seatbelt rule. With 16 seconds left in the game and Team A up big, B1 misses a free throw and B2 grabs the rebound, and the ball gets knocked OOB. Coach A, from his seat yells that B2 was in the lane early (she clearly wasn't), and I look at him and try to convey to him to stay in the game. Coach A then rises and stomps his foot yelling at us that B2 was in the lane early and how could we have missed it, to which I respond by giving him his second T and his walking papers. My question to you is, do you think there could have been a better way to handle the situation early to prevent the ejection or can you suggest something that I could have done to keep the coach in the game? Clearly, he did enough and deserved to get tossed, but I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions on how we could have handled the situation differently?
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 03:33am
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Why would you want to "keep the coach in the game?" If he deserved the Ts then he should get the Ts. I really do believe that officials do not give out Ts...Ts are earned by the recipients. Clearly this coach wanted to distract attention from his miserable team by his behavior. He did and you reacted appropriately after giving him the "stop" sign. Good job!
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 07:06am
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Quote:
Originally posted by firedoc
Why would you want to "keep the coach in the game?" If he deserved the Ts then he should get the Ts. I really do believe that officials do not give out Ts...Ts are earned by the recipients. Clearly this coach wanted to distract attention from his miserable team by his behavior. He did and you reacted appropriately after giving him the "stop" sign. Good job!

Can't say it any better than that. Agree completely.
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 08:57am
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You gave him the stop sign at first.

The first T was clearly warranted.

You gave "the look" before the second T.



Seems to me that you did everything you could.
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 09:09am
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Quote:
Originally posted by SMEngmann
My question to you is, do you think there could have been a better way to handle the situation early to prevent the ejection
Nope.

Quote:
Originally posted by SMEngmann
or can you suggest something that I could have done to keep the coach in the game? Clearly, he did enough and deserved to get tossed, but I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions on how we could have handled the situation differently?
From what you said, it sounds like everything was handled well. I try not take upon myself to babysit adults. He's a grown man. He should act like one. Stomping his feet is not adult-like.
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 09:29am
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mark Dexter
You gave "the look" before the second T.
Mark -- My dad called it "the hairy eyeball."
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 10:59am
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Quote:
Originally posted by rainmaker
My dad called it "the hairy eyeball."
Ok. That's sick.

Quote:
Originally posted by SMEngmann
I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions on how we could have handled the situation differently?
Let's be honest. The answer is maybe. And only you and your partner can judge this.
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 12:07pm
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Forget the seatbelt for a minute. Let's just look at Coach A's actions, seatbelt or not, and realize he has a big lead and is loudly protesting a no-call with 16 seconds left. The game is over but he can't let it end in peace. Note that to me, it doesn't even matter that he should be seated, or that the correct call (no call) was made. He is being a complete idiot given the game situation.

If this was a close game and you didn't want the T to be the deciding factor, this may or may not be one you can pass on. You saw and heard everything, I didn't. If you were handing it out strictly for violating the seatbelt and complaining, you will have to decide in a close game if this is the T you want to give. But given this situation, Coach A is clearly without any cause to be upset. If he needed to have a message sent, send it. To me, it sounds like he needed this message.
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 12:49pm
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Differently?

I might have laughed and said...

"OKAY Coach. If you want to be ejected with 16 seconds left in a game you are winning, I will eject you. Technical foul on the coach for unsporting behavior. We'll see you two games from now, Coach."
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 02:10pm
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IMHO, the coaches behavior as you described was clearly out of line & the T's were warranted - especially at this age group level. Not much you could have done to avoid it, and letting him get away with it would only encourage similar or worse behavior in the future.

What is it with some 6th grade girls coaches? Two seasons back I was working a holiday tournament (yes, 6th grade girls...) - team B was getting handily beaten & their coach wasn't taking it at all well. Mid-2nd quarter he let out with an loud expletive that caused me to assess his first T. Then late 3rd quarter when one of his players tried to cut between two defenders standing maybe a foot apart, he came onto the court screaming at my partner that there should have been a foul called on the resulting contact - earning him his 2nd T.

My partner went opposite side and I approached the coach and calmly told him that he was disqualified and would have to leave the building & that his assitant would have to take over coaching duties. His beligerant response was "what if I don't leave?" - so I calmly advised him that if he didn't leave promptly his team would forfeit the game - then asked the tournament site manager to escort him out of the gym.

Early 4th quarter during a dead ball, I just happened to catch some loud, rude comments from the stands - looked up & there's the ejected coach sitting with a couple dads - looking right at us & smirking. I immediately declared the game forfeit in favor of team A, then gathered all the players from both teams & made it clear that it wasn't anything they did, but that sometimes adults just couldn't behave themselves and we had to stop the game as a result.

What happened afterwards floored me - several of the moms from team B came over to us and thanked us for standing up to the coach - said his attitude & behavior was an ongoing problem & it was about time someone called a halt to it. Who woulda thunk it........
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  #11 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 03:49pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by SMEngmann
6th Grade girls game, team A is clearly superior to team B and dominating the game. Coach A is a bit of a howler and makes chirpy comments to me and my partner, particularly early in the 2nd half, earning him an acknowledgement and a stop sign (after he acted like a child when he wanted a backcourt call when B1 is straddling the division line and never gained front court status). After my partner makes a foul call on team B early in the 4th, he rises and yells, "It's about time we finally get a call, we're getting mugged out there," earning him his 1st technical from me. I went through the formalities and reminded him of the seatbelt rule. With 16 seconds left in the game and Team A up big, B1 misses a free throw and B2 grabs the rebound, and the ball gets knocked OOB. Coach A, from his seat yells that B2 was in the lane early (she clearly wasn't), and I look at him and try to convey to him to stay in the game. Coach A then rises and stomps his foot yelling at us that B2 was in the lane early and how could we have missed it, to which I respond by giving him his second T and his walking papers. My question to you is, do you think there could have been a better way to handle the situation early to prevent the ejection or can you suggest something that I could have done to keep the coach in the game? Clearly, he did enough and deserved to get tossed, but I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions on how we could have handled the situation differently?
I'd of whacked him on the over and back and would not have given the warning. He was chirping before that he and had a big lead, so no need for the stop sign.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 04:09pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by TimTaylor
Early 4th quarter during a dead ball, I just happened to catch some loud, rude comments from the stands - looked up & there's the ejected coach sitting with a couple dads - looking right at us & smirking. I immediately declared the game forfeit in favor of team A, then gathered all the players from both teams & made it clear that it wasn't anything they did, but that sometimes adults just couldn't behave themselves and we had to stop the game as a result.
I only wonder whether you could have found a way to let the kids finish it. I know you let him know the consequences, but I hate to see the kids lose out on playing a game because of this bozo.
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 05:42pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hawks Coach
Quote:
Originally posted by TimTaylor
Early 4th quarter during a dead ball, I just happened to catch some loud, rude comments from the stands - looked up & there's the ejected coach sitting with a couple dads - looking right at us & smirking. I immediately declared the game forfeit in favor of team A, then gathered all the players from both teams & made it clear that it wasn't anything they did, but that sometimes adults just couldn't behave themselves and we had to stop the game as a result.
I only wonder whether you could have found a way to let the kids finish it. I know you let him know the consequences, but I hate to see the kids lose out on playing a game because of this bozo.
Unfortunately, sometimes the kids do suffer due to the choices of adults. But, sometimes, that's when the most is learned. It was their coach that did it to them and the parents seemed to agree and like the approach. Until someone actually did something about the coach, the kids were learning that what he was doing was tolerable. The kids may have lost some playing time (it was the 4th quarter) but I bet the effect of the coaches bad behavior would last a lot longer than a few more minutes of game time.
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 06:48pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hawks Coach
Quote:
Originally posted by TimTaylor
Early 4th quarter during a dead ball, I just happened to catch some loud, rude comments from the stands - looked up & there's the ejected coach sitting with a couple dads - looking right at us & smirking. I immediately declared the game forfeit in favor of team A, then gathered all the players from both teams & made it clear that it wasn't anything they did, but that sometimes adults just couldn't behave themselves and we had to stop the game as a result.
I only wonder whether you could have found a way to let the kids finish it. I know you let him know the consequences, but I hate to see the kids lose out on playing a game because of this bozo.
I know what you're saying HC, but seems to me, the only one to blame for those kids losing out is their coach.
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old Tue Mar 30, 2004, 12:59am
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Thanks for all the feedback. Clearly this coach deserved in my opinion to be thrown out, I just like to revisit the game to see if I could have managed things differently earlier in order to prevent an ejection and I thought using this board as a sounding board was a good idea. I got the idea from one of the senior officials in my association after I threw out a GV coach at the end of a close game for coming onto the court after having a call go against him for his 2nd T. The vet broke down the tape and showed where certain situations and game awareness could potentially have prevented the ejection (though all parties agreed the ejection was warrented). It's an interesting way to critique game management skills.

Regarding the comment about T ing the coach on the first over and back complaint, I understand this line of thinking, but the early grumbles weren't frequent or annoying enough to earn a warning, so I felt that warning the guy was the right move so that the T from me or my partner wouldn't be a shock to him.
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