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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Sun Mar 28, 2004, 11:51pm
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I cannot believe the bias toward Tenn. called in the game tonight at the end of the game. The officials "passed" on the push (by TN) on the missed layup and have the nerve to call a foul going for the ball with .3 seconds left. Every tournament game I've ever watched or officiated usually permits the players to decide the game. How could those officials after reviewing the tape have the nerve to LET Pat Summit and her big program BE GIVEN that foul and not let the game go in overtime, I want to know. My opinion is that CONTACT, NO ADVANTAGE with both rebounders back to the rim with one second left is part of the game, not a foul. The contact took place the same time as the final horn. Would those "experience/older" officials not hold their whisle on that and let the horn sound and OT decide the game knowing what time was left? My opinion is those officials should not work another tournament game this year for blowing that one. Its plays like this that infuriate and challenge me to work harder at earning a higher level game. What do you think happened in this situation?
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 12:05am
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Quote:
Originally posted by markcolopy
I cannot believe the bias toward Tenn. called in the game tonight at the end of the game. The officials "passed" on the push (by TN) on the missed layup and have the nerve to call a foul going for the ball with .3 seconds left. Every tournament game I've ever watched or officiated usually permits the players to decide the game. How could those officials after reviewing the tape have the nerve to LET Pat Summit and her big program BE GIVEN that foul and not let the game go in overtime, I want to know. My opinion is that CONTACT, NO ADVANTAGE with both rebounders back to the rim with one second left is part of the game, not a foul. The contact took place the same time as the final horn. Would those "experience/older" officials not hold their whisle on that and let the horn sound and OT decide the game knowing what time was left? My opinion is those officials should not work another tournament game this year for blowing that one. Its plays like this that infuriate and challenge me to work harder at earning a higher level game. What do you think happened in this situation?
I thought the call at the end was questionable. The time had nothing to do with it. Both players came together and because the Tennessee player fell back, the Baylor player got nailed. That said, the women announcers sitting around the desk blasting the officials are some of the worst commentators/analysts I've ever seen. They wanted to get fired up about it, but it just seemed so forced.

What push are you talking about? The only thing that happened before the call was a rebound on the missed layup. The Tennessee player had verticality -- she went straight up to rebound the ball and the inside Baylor player jumped back into her slightly as the Tennessee player missed the put back.

I focused on this part each time they showed the replay because Muffy or Gidget or Bambi or whatever the he!! the Baylor's coach's name is was standing there claiming the "over the back" that I think you are talking about. Nope. Uh uh.

In the end, Baylor left Tennessee hang in too long and then turned the ball over when they had a tie game and the last shot. Too bad for them.

--Rich
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 12:05am
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i agree with you whole heartedly. i could not believe that they passed on the over the back call on tennessee, and gae the foul to the baylor girl that was innocent on the loose ball. i absolutly couldnt believe it. totally disgrace to a really good basketball game.

mighty
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 12:10am
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I can live with that reply, however, from an officials perspective I didn't see much meeting/discussion between all three officials to stick with the referee's decision. Shouldn't the other two officials have had some say in this. I liked how the decision was made right away, but I'm sure everything considered and on the line (not to mention Baylor's calm coaching demeanor on the sideline the whole game) would have warranted a different call from me.
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 12:17am
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Quote:
Originally posted by mightyvol
i agree with you whole heartedly. i could not believe that they passed on the over the back call on tennessee, and gae the foul to the baylor girl that was innocent on the loose ball. i absolutly couldnt believe it. totally disgrace to a really good basketball game.

mighty
That wasn't a foul. The Tennessee player went straight up and got the ball. Too many officials WOULD'VE called that one and penalized the Tennessee player for (1) jumping and (2) for being tall.

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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 12:19am
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Quote:
Originally posted by markcolopy
I cannot believe the bias toward Tenn. called in the game tonight at the end of the game. The officials "passed" on the push (by TN) on the missed layup and have the nerve to call a foul going for the ball with .3 seconds left. Every tournament game I've ever watched or officiated usually permits the players to decide the game.
They did decide the game. The player made a foul.


Quote:
Originally posted by markcolopy
How could those officials after reviewing the tape have the nerve to LET Pat Summit and her big program BE GIVEN that foul and not let the game go in overtime, I want to know.
They called a foul, then looked at the tape to decide which came first. The foul or the horn. The foul came first, so they have to shoot the FTs.

Quote:
Originally posted by markcolopy
My opinion is that CONTACT, NO ADVANTAGE with both rebounders back to the rim with one second left is part of the game, not a foul. The contact took place the same time as the final horn.
Well, you were not one of the officials on the game. Neither was I. So what we think does not matter.

Quote:
Originally posted by markcolopy
Would those "experience/older" officials not hold their whisle on that and let the horn sound and OT decide the game knowing what time was left?
No. You are not looking directly at the clock, you are looking at the game clock. Not sure how an official doing their job would even know exactly what time is on the clock. A foul that was called in the first minute, should be called at the last minute. Of course you want to make it be there if you make a call at the end, but the players have to know what has been called and adjust accordingly.

Quote:
Originally posted by markcolopy
My opinion is those officials should not work another tournament game this year for blowing that one.
Well you know the saying about opinions and a$$holes.

Quote:
Originally posted by markcolopy
Its plays like this that infuriate and challenge me to work harder at earning a higher level game.
Well if you do what you suggest, you will never make it to the next level. If you make a call, you cannot take it back because you want the players "to decide the game."

Quote:
Originally posted by markcolopy
What do you think happened in this situation?
I think the officials followed the rules. This is exactly why they allow the video tape at the end of games to determine what happen first. The shot, the foul, the buzzer or anything having to deal with the time. But then again, if you ever work that level (unlikely with your attitude), but how the rules are written and practiced. Sorry it does not fit your shallow way of thinking.

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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 12:51am
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in all honesty guys come on. who are you trying to kid. the right call should have been a no call. rich you are out of your mind if that wasnt over the back. as far as it not being called i can live with that, what i cant live with is the fact that a great game was determined on a very very questionable call. the fact of the matter is that they blew the whistle and life goes on, but dont tell me that the over the back wasnt more obvious than the loose ball foul. come on rich.

mighty
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 12:59am
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Quote:
Originally posted by mightyvol
in all honesty guys come on. who are you trying to kid. the right call should have been a no call. rich you are out of your mind if that wasnt over the back. as far as it not being called i can live with that, what i cant live with is the fact that a great game was determined on a very very questionable call. the fact of the matter is that they blew the whistle and life goes on, but dont tell me that the over the back wasnt more obvious than the loose ball foul. come on rich.

mighty
There is no such thing as "over the back." Watch the tape. The Tennessee player jumped straight up and rebounded the ball. Watch the Baylor player jump up and back into the Tennessee player.

Are you an official?
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 01:03am
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Quote:
Originally posted by mightyvol
in all honesty guys come on. who are you trying to kid. the right call should have been a no call. rich you are out of your mind if that wasnt over the back. as far as it not being called i can live with that, what i cant live with is the fact that a great game was determined on a very very questionable call. the fact of the matter is that they blew the whistle and life goes on, but dont tell me that the over the back wasnt more obvious than the loose ball foul. come on rich.

mighty
What the hell is "over the back?" You either have a push or a block, but "over the back" is not a call. Two players jumping for the ball is not a foul if one player is taller. I admit I did not see the entire game, but I did see the highlight and what I saw I would not call a foul for the play you wanted. I could see the play that was called a foul. But that is best determined by what was called the entire game. If that was called earlier, it has to be called at the end.

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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 01:04am
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the girl from tennessee is running 100 miles an hour for the rebound. how in the hell can she come to a complete stop in mid-air and not go over the baylor girls back. she is not wonder woman. i am an official and a pretty damn good one at that. for you to tell me that the girl wasnt over the back is your opinion, but i say take in the concept that she is coming hard down the court and she is attacking the rack. i give the official credit for not calling o/b ,but to call the loose ball foul was not right. do you here me?

mighty
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 01:10am
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im letting it rest. nuff said. thats what makes this profession soo great. we all have an opinion and we all are in judgement situations. in this officials judgement he called a foul. i didnt think it was right, but he saw it differently than i did. would i have made the call? i dont know. im sure hes replaying it over and over in his head as we speak. coulda,shoulda, and woulda are out the door when we have to react on a split second. bottom line is he called a foul, would i have made the call? I DONT KNOW?

not trying to start something rich just giving my opinion.

peace.

mighty
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 01:24am
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Quote:
Originally posted by mightyvol
the girl from tennessee is running 100 miles an hour for the rebound. how in the hell can she come to a complete stop in mid-air and not go over the baylor girls back. she is not wonder woman.

It is called talent. And he did not make any significant contact with the Baylor player. She out jumped the Baylor player.


Quote:
Originally posted by mightyvol
i am an official and a pretty damn good one at that.
Are you sure? They must be really hurting for officials if you are calling "over the back."

Quote:
Originally posted by mightyvol
for you to tell me that the girl wasnt over the back is your opinion, but i say take in the concept that she is coming hard down the court and she is attacking the rack.
Well you need to look at the replay. I just saw the replay and I am not sure I have ever seen a player come 100 miles an hour on foot before, but the rule is verticality and she did not violate the girl's space. She did out jump her to make a tip and did not even knock the other girl down. And if it was anything, it would of had to be a PC foul, considering there was no contact before the tip and very slight contact after she attempted to tip the ball. If you make that call, you really cannot be that good of an official as you say you are. Or maybe you are one of the many girl's officials that could not work a boy's game if you got that opportunity. Mainly because you call sorry fouls like you claim took place.


Quote:
Originally posted by mightyvol
i give the official credit for not calling o/b ,but to call the loose ball foul was not right. do you here me?

mighty
The Baylor player knocked the Tenn player completely down after she had an opportunity to get the ball. Are you sure you are an official?

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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 01:32am
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you are right and i am wrong. nuff said. ill officiate with you any time and any place. all i ask is that you respect me. if you cant do that than do unto others that they have done to you mr rutledge.

mighty
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 01:36am
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Thumbs down Respect

Quote:
Originally posted by mightyvol
you are right and i am wrong. nuff said. ill officiate with you any time and any place. all i ask is that you respect me. if you cant do that than do unto others that they have done to you mr rutledge.

mighty
You are the one coming here telling the world how screwed up they were by making the correct call. And you want to talk about respect? You lost the little respect you had by talking about officials that are on a level that you or I have not achieved. And to use the term "over the back" when a player outjumped another is laughable. Keep up the good work, since you are a "damn good official."

Peace
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Old Mon Mar 29, 2004, 01:38am
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i must say you are a class act.

thanks again, i only learn from the best mr rutledge.

take care.

mighty
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