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  #16 (permalink)  
Old Sun Apr 04, 2021, 06:12pm
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The Mouse Ran Up The Clock ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Goodwin View Post
It doesn't. The digit for 7 minutes is obscured at the top, then the same happens with the top part of the 6.
Got it. Thanks.
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)

“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old Sun Apr 04, 2021, 06:42pm
Do not give a damn!!
 
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Location: On the border
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I would need more context honestly. If that is all they did, probably not. If they said something to me, then sure I might be more likely to consider a T. But if this is the first incident, it would not likely come from me in this case, if I even saw this at all.

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  #18 (permalink)  
Old Sun Apr 04, 2021, 07:56pm
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Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Fairbanks, Alaska
Posts: 36
Last, safe haven?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
Sorry. Not playing with you today. I've been punished by one time out in fifteen years here on the Forum. I don't want another one.

You came close to getting me suspended a few weeks ago for your reply, and my follow-up reply, to a Paradise By The Dashboard Light reference.

Encourage me to get in trouble once, shame on me. Encourage me to get in trouble twice, shame on you.
Absolutely, positively not my intent, BillyMac; not even close.

With all sincerity, I apologize to you for being on the brink of getting suspended.

Kindly note, moderators & administrators: 'Twas I who engaged BillyMac in the exchange of song titles and lyrics. I've seen the work of BillyMac for at least a couple of years now and I know how & when to scroll past things that appear off topic. With the increase in the number of FB pages with "referee," or "rules," or "basketball officiating" in their titles, my guess is that traffic to this site has decreased (although I do see some names that are very familiar to both here and that Zuckerberg product). That said, this is likely the single, best place on the 'interweb' to be able to search for anything basketball-rules related, especially with NFHS rules.

I regret my decision to engage in a little, slightly off-the-main-topic inclusion of thing(s) that might just make a personal connection between two human beings with a decades-long love for a shared avocation (that is, sports officiating) that otherwise might not occur with 4,400 actual miles or so between us.

Lord know this isn't the first mistake I've made, and it certainly won't be the last.

Happy Easter everyone!
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old Mon Apr 05, 2021, 08:42am
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Connection (The Rolling Stones, 1967) ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Goodwin View Post
... make a personal connection between two human beings with a decades-long love for a shared avocation (that is, sports officiating) that otherwise might not occur with 4,400 actual miles or so between us ...
Get a room. Wait ... I'm being told ... Really? I'm one of them? You're kidding? How did I miss that? Never mind.
__________________
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)

“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)

Last edited by BillyMac; Mon Apr 05, 2021 at 12:29pm.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old Mon Apr 05, 2021, 10:26am
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 19,723
Celosia (Cockscomb) ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Goodwin View Post
If I could figure out how to shrink pictures on this forum, I would include them.
Use Google Images (searches for internet photos based on a photo rather than words). Click on the camera icon. Load your photo (internet address or from your hard drive). See if there are Medium or Small versions of the photo on the internet. Right click and copy photo's internet address. Post smaller photo on the Forum using the Forum Insert Image icon.

https://images.google.com/

It's an amazing tool. I came across a flower that I wanted to know the name of. Took a photo, put it on my hard drive, used Google Images, found a similar photo, clicked on the website that contained the photo of the flower, got the name of the flower, Celosia (Cockscomb). So easy a caveman can do it. I use it a lot to find better photos (better than the photos that I first find) for the articles that I write on our kayak paddle group website describing history, geography, ecology, etc., of the locations that we paddle and visit.

To post your own photos on the Forum, use an image hosting website, like Flickr (I'm sure that there are others), to post your photos (set up an account, set a password, and use cloud upload icon), which will generate an internet address for them. Again, right click on the Flickr (or other) photo to get an internet address and copy and paste the photo's internet address to the Forum. Easy peasey lemon squeezy.

https://www.flickr.com/

__________________
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)

“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)

Last edited by BillyMac; Mon Apr 05, 2021 at 01:17pm.
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 06, 2021, 12:30am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Fairbanks, Alaska
Posts: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
Got it. Thanks.
Best I can do, so far:

clock at 7:01

clock at 6:59

You can see the support system in a different place than the original video.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 06, 2021, 12:06pm
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 19,723
Not Easy Peasy Lemon Squeezy ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Goodwin View Post
Best I can do, so far.
Good start.

Better: Log on to your Flickr Photostream.
Double left click on the photo that you want to post on the Forum.
Bottom right: Click downward arrow icon (Download This Photo).
Left click on View All Sizes.
Left click to select a size (for example Medium 500 (500 Χ 374)).
Right click on image to select Copy Image Address.
Paste image address into Forum post (yellow and gray mountain and sun Insert Image icon).

Voilΰ (pardon my French).

__________________
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)

“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)

Last edited by BillyMac; Tue Apr 06, 2021 at 12:11pm.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 06, 2021, 01:01pm
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Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Kansas
Posts: 563
Technical fouls I've given this past season....

1. to HC for audibly voicing his displeasure at a female ref partner's reluctance to call a foul when his player clearly "chucked" the ball up looking for "bail out" call--then there being no call, this HC said, quite loudly: "somebody please help HER out!"

2. to player cursing to another player on his same team; and this occurred at a Catholic highschool no less!

3. to HC for repetitive demonstrative exclamations of: " 8 fouls to 2 fouls--are you kidding me!?" I admit that the first time he said it, I stopped the clock and documented a "warning notice" in the scorebook, then he persisted (ostensibly believing that I didn't have the gumption to tech him up).

4. to player for turning to me and loudly exclaiming--after said player missed a bunny layup under defensive pressure--"c'mon ref that's a foul!"; this despite his teammate telling him to "STFU you're always complaining".

Quite to my surprise, sometimes when I'm driving home from a game I will think over certain scenarios from the game and to be honest, there were more times that I "passed" on issuing a technical foul when in retrospect I should've issued one.


*In summary, it seems that my threshold for imposing technical fouls is lower when a HC doing/saying things that imply that I am biased/unfair and also when they berate a female partner(s). Oh and before I close, in the video subject of this thread, I'd have issued and documented a "formal warning" at minimum for slapping the score table; however, I could've gone straight to a tech depending on the gestalt.

Last edited by Kansas Ref; Tue Apr 06, 2021 at 01:08pm.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 06, 2021, 01:34pm
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Regrets, I've Had A Few (My Way, Frank Sinatra, 1969) …

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kansas Ref View Post
... when I'm driving home from a game I will think over certain scenarios from the game and to be honest, there were more times that I "passed" on issuing a technical foul when in retrospect I should've issued one ...
We always seem to regret the technical fouls we passed on. We never seem to regret the technical fouls we issued.

Many years ago. Girls varsity prep school game. With seconds to go in the first half, girl trips (she didn't get tripped, she tripped) and gets severely hurt. Head coach and trainer come out to attend to her in front of her bench. During the several minutes it took to attend to her, the coach has a few irate words for us (more than just one outburst) to indicate his displeasure in my partner and I "causing his player to get hurt". We should have said, "Shut up and deal with your player's injury. You're not allowed out here on the floor to take pot shots at us" (or something more professional than that), but not wanting to detract from the serious injury situation in front of us, my partner and I both physically retreated away from the situation on the floor to the opposite table side of the court, and passed on a well deserved technical foul.

At halftime, in the privacy of the dressing room, we discussed it and decided that the severity of the injury, and our concern for the injured player, "numbed" us to the poor behavior of the coach, but that he "wouldn't get away with it", and that he would be immediately T-ed up for any unsporting comment, no matter how slight, in the second half (probably unprofessional to make him an automatic T-target, but he deserved it).

We're both still waiting for that unsporting comment. We missed our chance and he got away with murder (hyperbole).
__________________
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)

“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)

Last edited by BillyMac; Tue Apr 06, 2021 at 05:25pm.
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 06, 2021, 01:54pm
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Bottom-line, any official who gave this coach a Technical would be 100% justified and there would be no reason for second guessing.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 06, 2021, 02:29pm
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While I have maintained my OhioHSAA registration and my memberships in IAABO, Ohio Assn. of Bkb. Off., Trumbull and Wood Counties Bkb. Assns., my last year of officiating was the 2016-17 season, I while I know that I had one or two TFs that year, I cannot remember any of them, !

MTD, Sr.
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Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
Trumbull Co. (Warren, Ohio) Bkb. Off. Assn.
Wood Co. (Bowling Green, Ohio) Bkb. Off. Assn.
Ohio Assn. of Basketball Officials
International Assn. of Approved Bkb. Officials
Ohio High School Athletic Association
Toledo, Ohio
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 06, 2021, 02:54pm
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Died And Went To Heaven ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kansas Ref View Post
Technical fouls I've given this past season ...
No technical fouls to coaches this past season. First, and only, time in forty years of officiating. Didn't even consider any technical fouls to coaches this past season.

The stars lined up. Shortened COVID season, I only worked about a dozen games this season. Coaches seemed just pleased to be playing, and also seemed to appreciate those of us that showed up, more than half of our local guys, mostly older veterans, opted out due to COVID concerns. Lack of fans (none, one, or two parents allowed per player) seemed to quiet coaches down. No state tournament to qualify for. Just conference playoffs, and all teams qualified.

Not proud of it. Not ashamed of it. It just happened. Just odd. One for the books.
__________________
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)

“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)

Last edited by BillyMac; Tue Apr 06, 2021 at 05:26pm.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old Fri Apr 09, 2021, 10:58am
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IAABO Survey Says …

Disclaimer: For IAABO eyes only. Below is not a NFHS interpretation, it's only an IAABO interpretation which obviously doesn't mean a hill of beans to most members of this Forum.

https://storage.googleapis.com/refqu...K1X%2F9w%3D%3D

IAABO Play Commentary: Correct Answer: The coach should have been assessed a technical foul.

This narrative in no way should be viewed as passing judgment on these fine officials seen in this clip. We have the luxury of focusing only on the actions and behavior of the head coach. When the game is in progress, the officials may not be aware of all of the activity occurring in the bench area.

Let's review the actions/behaviors of the head coach in the scenario presented in this play.
1) He is standing outside of the coaching box. (Violating 10-6-1)
2) He reacts to a ruling by using gestures with his arms. (Violating 10-5-1e)
3) He slaps the scorer's table with his hand. (Violating 10-5-1)
4) He directs a comment toward the official. "Call the foul!" (Violating 10-5-1a)

The items above are all infractions that may lead to a warning to a head coach for misconduct. However, based on the fact that there are multiple infractions of the bench decorum rules on the same play, there is more than enough rules support to consider his actions as "major" and assess an unsporting technical foul in this situation. (10-5-1, 10-6-1)

For 12% of respondents, the correct ruling in this play would be to dismiss the head coach's actions and behaviors and allow play to continue. However, there is no rules support to ignore the head coach on this play.

When a head coach is outside the coaching box, officials are required by rule to address the issue. When the first violation of Rule 10-6-1 occurs, the official must warn the head coach unless the offense is judged to be major, in which case a technical foul must be assessed. (4-48-2)

Even If the officials deem his actions as "minor," at the very least, a warning would need to be issued. Furthermore, the fact that a participant (player, coach or other bench personnel) spontaneously reacts to a situation has no bearing on the legality of the behavior or action. All involved are required by rule to conduct themselves in a sportsmanlike manner throughout the contest.

Another essential aspect of this play is understanding that the opponents are advancing the ball and actively seeking to score while this unsporting behavior is occurring. In this case, officials are asked to withhold their whistle and assess a penalty after the play is completed. (Case Book 10.5.1 Situation F) In this play, when the ball entered the basket and became dead, the technical foul penalty should be assessed at that time. Again, if the actions were deemed "minor," this would also be when the behavior warning should be issued.

After the score, the "new" Lead official moves into the frontcourt near the bench area, takes the whistle out of her mouth to talk to the coach. Officials should not take the whistle out of their mouth to talk to a coach during a live ball with the clock running. Verbal communication should be during dead ball periods. Officials should not allow a coach to affect their ability to focus on the court. (IAABO Manual p. 104 1.a)

After the score, the new Trail official is essentially left alone to deal with a full-court pressing situation while the new Lead is talking with the coach. This is an excellent example of how talking to coaches during a live ball can negatively impact the officials.

The bench decorum and behavior warnings rules are essential for all officials to master. Officials should know exactly what aspects of rule 10-5-1 and 10-6-1 may be warned and what aspects must be assessed as a technical foul.


Here is the breakdown of the IAABO members that commented on the video: The coach should have been assessed a warning 47% (including me). The coach should have been assessed a technical foul 41%. This is a spontaneous reaction and does not need to be addressed 12%.
__________________
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)

“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)

Last edited by BillyMac; Sun Apr 11, 2021 at 01:01pm.
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