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Old Thu Feb 04, 2021, 01:19pm
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Fun With Free Throws

I originally didn't want to post this video on the Forum because I didn't think it was a tough situation. That is until I later received the IAABO International Play Commentary.

https://storage.googleapis.com/refqu...yEpSlLdEgq.mp4

IAABO International only gives two choices: free throw violation, or not a free throw violation.

My comment: Free throw violation. Offensive White #30 clearly left her designated area and intruded into Blue #22's area before the release. Immediate violation on White #30.

Disclaimer: For IAABO Eyes Only. Below is not a NFHS interpretation, it's only an IAABO International interpretation which obviously doesn't mean a hill of beans to most members of this Forum.

IAABO International Play Commentary: Correct Answer: This is not a free throw violation.

In this play, White #30, in a marked lane space, attempts to maneuver behind her opponent to obtain a rebounding position in the lane. Her initial position along the lane is legal. She has at least one foot near the outer edge of the free-throw lane line. This player moves laterally toward her opponent's marked lane space.

A player occupying a (36-inch by 36-inch) marked lane space may not have either foot beyond the vertical plane of any edge of the space designated by lane-space marks. (9-1-3g) This restriction ends upon the release of the try.

This ruling will be based on whether or not she left her marked lane space and moved into an opponent's marked lane space before the try was released. Breaking this plane of the outside edge (with a foot) before the ball is released would be a free-throw violation.

In this play, it appears the free throw is released just before White #30, breaks the plane of her marked lane space, which makes this a legal play.


Here is the breakdown of the IAABO members that commented on the video (only two choices): Not a violation 69%; Free throw violation 31% (including me).

Thoughts?
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Last edited by BillyMac; Sun Feb 07, 2021 at 02:18pm.
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Old Thu Feb 04, 2021, 02:11pm
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Fool Me Once, Shame On Me ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
... it appears the free throw is released just before White #30, breaks the plane of her marked lane space, which makes this a legal play ...
Looked at it again at 1/4 speed (an option for IAABO members). I now believe that I was incorrect, and that there was no violation.

What fooled me was that while White #30's body clearly crossed the lane space plane before the release, her foot (the body part that counts) didn't cross the plane until after the release.
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Old Thu Feb 04, 2021, 02:43pm
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I agree with the IAABO ruling of no violation. The feet of #30 white are both inside the volleyball court at the time of the release, so neither is outside of her own lane space and she has her right foot near the FT lane line.
She just timed this well.
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Old Thu Feb 04, 2021, 02:52pm
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Perfect ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref View Post
She just timed this well.
Disagree. No just. Not well.

Perfectly well. Kudos to her.
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Old Thu Feb 04, 2021, 03:44pm
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It looks strange because her first step with her left foot is rather large. But the step is towards the sideline, not the endline. I do not believe she was outside the 3x3 space in either direction.
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Old Thu Feb 04, 2021, 04:04pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Altor View Post
It looks strange because her first step with her left foot is rather large. But the step is towards the sideline, not the endline. I do not believe she was outside the 3x3 space in either direction.
And because it's preceded by a stutter step with the right foot. All that movement makes it look like "she must be out of the space."

I do note that the RF *might* be over the lane space mark on the stutter step -- resulting in a technical violation, if true.
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Old Thu Feb 04, 2021, 05:23pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
Looked at it again at 1/4 speed (an option for IAABO members). I now believe that I was incorrect, and that there was no violation.

What fooled me was that while White #30's body clearly crossed the lane space plane before the release, her foot (the body part that counts) didn't cross the plane until after the release.

In real time, it looked marginal at best -- especially with the camera angle -- as to whether W30 was out of her lane space before the free thrower released the try. I'd likely pass on this (can't call what we're not 100% sure about), but I'd also be watching that more closely for the rest of the game to catch any violations that might occur.
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Old Thu Feb 04, 2021, 05:35pm
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She Must Be Out Of The Space ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
... while White #30's body clearly crossed the lane space plane before the release ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Altor View Post
It looks strange because her first step with her left foot is rather large. But the step is towards the sideline, not the endline.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
And because it's preceded by a stutter step with the right foot. All that movement makes it look like "she must be out of the space."
Lots of distracting stuff going on here, but we should all be better at ignoring distractions and on concentrating on what we're supposed to be watching for here.

Right?

She did fool me. I've got to be better.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stat-Man View Post
I'd also be watching that more closely for the rest of the game to catch any violations that might occur.
A wake up call. Live and learn.
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Last edited by BillyMac; Thu Feb 04, 2021 at 07:46pm.
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Old Thu Feb 04, 2021, 10:48pm
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How far back is a player allowed to back out of a free throw lane space while the shooter still has the ball?

Her left foot is outside of the letter T that is on the end line prior to the release of the free throw.

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Old Thu Feb 04, 2021, 11:46pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raymond View Post
How far back is a player allowed to back out of a free throw lane space while the shooter still has the ball?

Her left foot is outside of the letter T that is on the end line prior to the release of the free throw.
That was my thought process as well. If the space is only 36" deep, I'd say her foot has passed that standard -- and that's how I voted.

Billy, how do you have the percentage breakdowns of the IAABO voters on these plays? I'm a member and view/vote on them all, yet all I ever see is the colored pie chart (with no numerical data) when the play summaries are posted.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2021, 11:02am
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Define Near ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raymond View Post
How far back is a player allowed to back out of a free throw lane space while the shooter still has the ball?
Depends on one's stride length and one's definition of "near".

9-1-3-G: A player occupying a marked lane space may not have either foot beyond the vertical plane of the outside edge of any lane boundary, or beyond the vertical plane of any edge of the space (2 inches by 36 inches) designated by lane-space marks. A player must position one foot near the outer edge of the free-throw lane line. The other foot may be positioned anywhere within the designated 36-inch lane space until the ball has been released.
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Last edited by BillyMac; Fri Feb 05, 2021 at 11:07am.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2021, 11:06am
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Stride Length ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ODog View Post
If the space is only 36" deep, I'd say her foot has passed that standard ...
It isn't necessarily always 36 inches deep, it theoretically could be more (or less).

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
9-1-3-G: A player occupying a marked lane space may not have either foot beyond the vertical plane of the outside edge of any lane boundary, or beyond the vertical plane of any edge of the space (2 inches by 36 inches) designated by lane-space marks. A player must position one foot near the outer edge of the free-throw lane line. The other foot may be positioned anywhere within the designated 36-inch lane space until the ball has been released.
She keeps her right foot "near" the lane line until the ball is released.
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I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36)

Last edited by BillyMac; Fri Feb 05, 2021 at 11:37am.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2021, 11:11am
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I don't have the FED book handy, but this is from NCAAW (NCAAM is the same):

Art. 4. The lane-space marks and blocks shall identify the lane space areas that
extend 36 inches from the outer edge of the lane lines toward the sidelines.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2021, 11:17am
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Pickett Slide Rule ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ODog View Post
... percentage breakdowns of the IAABO voters on these plays? I'm a member and view/vote on them all, yet all I ever see is the colored pie chart (with no numerical data) when the play summaries are posted.
Hover your cursor over the different colors in the pie chart and the number of votes will appear for each colored section. Get out a pencil and some scratch paper to add up the total votes and then get out your Pickett slide rule to figure out the percentage by dividing the number of votes in each colored section by the total number of votes.

My Pickett slide rule is always easily accessible because I always keep it in a leather case clipped to my black belt. I would never leave home without it. It's a chick magnet I tell you, a chick magnet.

After hot single women spot my Pickett slide rule, and after I tell them that that I raise backyard chickens, photograph sunspots, and have spent a lot of time in prison, I have to fight them off with a stick. It's true.

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Last edited by BillyMac; Fri Feb 05, 2021 at 11:42am.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2021, 11:38am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
Depends on one's stride length and one's definition of "near".

9-1-3-G: A player occupying a marked lane space may not have either foot beyond the vertical plane of the outside edge of any lane boundary, or beyond the vertical plane of any edge of the space (2 inches by 36 inches) designated by lane-space marks. A player must position one foot near the outer edge of the free-throw lane line. The other foot may be positioned anywhere within the designated 36-inch lane space until the ball has been released.
So, regardless of one's stride length, there is a 36" limit to how far that back foot can go prior to release. In this case, I believe it gives her an advantage in trying to circle around the defender in the bottom space.
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