Flop

[hoopologist]

I know this is a relatively old thread - and perhaps not seen nor visited ...

I'm curious if officials working HS games have feelings one way or another about "flop" and an RA at the HS level and if so, what are they and why?

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by hoopologist

I know this is a relatively old thread - and perhaps not seen nor visited ...

I'm curious if officials working HS games have feelings one way or another about "flop" and an RA at the HS level and if so, what are they and why?

Flop rules...bring them on, I think that would be a good tool.

RA...I hope not. We have enough trouble getting people to understand the rules relating to block/charge (i.e., LGP and verticality) as it is. No need to double the complexity of the situation.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Forty years. Never called a technical foul for faking a foul. Never observed a technical foul for faking a foul. Made a few comments (warnings). Heard a few comments (warnings). But that was the total extent of these situations. It's been several years since I even thought that a high school player was faking being fouled.

Like the idea of a NFHS official written warning. Better than an unofficial, "Cut that out".

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

RA ... We have enough trouble getting people to understand the rules relating to block/charge (i.e., LGP and verticality) as it is. No need to double the complexity of the situation.

It would definitely not be case of, "Double Your Pleasure, Double You Fun", especially with two person crews.

[Mike Goodwin]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Flop rules...bring them on, I think that would be a good tool.

RA...I hope not. We have enough trouble getting people to understand the rules relating to block/charge (i.e., LGP and verticality) as it is. No need to double the complexity of the situation.

Similar to the "book warning" to a head coach / team personnel for misconduct, now would be a good time for the NFHS to adopt a "book warning" for embellishment (I'm not a fan of the word "flop.")

RA? No way! A ball handler should be liable for a player-control foul anywhere on the 4,200 (or 4,700) square feet of playing surface. That, and what Camron said about the complexity.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

1) Billy, I know that I have joked about Alternating Possession being and abomination upon the game but while I am not a fan of it something Alternation Possession it is something that I can live with for the time being.

2) The real abomination upon the game is the Restricted Arc, Secondary Defender, Lower Defensive Box, and the Defensive Three Seconds Violation, all of which discussions of another day.

3) My position on "flopping". I am sure that you can search this Forum as well as many of the Facebook basketball officiating groups for my position on "flopping". So lets start by looking at: https://forum.officiating.com/basket...o-contact.html and I bring everyone's attention to two of my comments:


Comment #10 on Page 1:

It is not a TF for "flopping", it is a TF for faking being fouled.

If B1 has a LGP against A1 and while in his/her LGP A1, makes contact with any part of B1's body that tells us that A1 encroached B1's Cylinder of Verticality meaning that if a Foul is to be charged it should be charged to A1.

We have all seen videos and have officiated games where B1 has a LGP against A1 and A1 breaches B1's Cylinder of Verticality. The contact looks minimal and yet B1 falls backwards even falling to the Floor sometimes. Many people describe B1 as "flopping". Who knows for sure if B1 over acted from A1's contact? Whether or not B1 is guilty or not of overacting he/she cannot be charged with any type of Foul (Personal or Technical) because B1 was in a LGP when A1 breached B1's Cylinder of Verticality.

When it comes to faking being fouled. I officiated H.S. soccer for 14 years. Basketball players are not the actors that soccer players are.

I officiated basketball for 46 years and have watched Mark, Jr. officiate basketball for another 5 years and I cannot remember ever seeing a basketball player fake being fouled.


Comment #18 on Page 2:

1) Has B1 Obtained (NFHS and NCAA Women's)/Established (NCAA Men's and FIBA) LGP? If YES, go to (2) and if NO, go to (4).

2) Was the contact between A1 and B1 within B1's Cylinder of Verticality? If yes, to (3).

3) PF by A1 against B1.

4) PF by B1 against A1.

It does not get any easier than that.


MTD, Sr.