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Old Thu Jan 31, 2019, 06:09pm
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Delay of game question

We had a situation recently in my chapter that I'd like some opinions on. A is trailing by 5 points. A1 makes a layup, cutting the margin to 3 points, with 4-point-something on the clock, still running. A1 grabs the ball out of the net and throws it back toward his own bench. I am aware of the specific rule/case directing the officials to ignore this delay and allow time to expire. However, at least one of the officials on this game was not aware, and blew the whistle to stop play. Now what?
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Old Thu Jan 31, 2019, 06:28pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Pennsylvania Coach View Post
We had a situation recently in my chapter that I'd like some opinions on. A is trailing by 5 points. A1 makes a layup, cutting the margin to 3 points, with 4-point-something on the clock, still running. A1 grabs the ball out of the net and throws it back toward his own bench. I am aware of the specific rule/case directing the officials to ignore this delay and allow time to expire. However, at least one of the officials on this game was not aware, and blew the whistle to stop play. Now what?
Since he failed to follow the case play ruling and sounded his whistle, the official needs to charge a team technical foul. That is the only way to prevent the scoring team from unfairly benefitting from the illegal action.
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Old Thu Jan 31, 2019, 06:53pm
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Originally Posted by Nevadaref View Post
Since he failed to follow the case play ruling and sounded his whistle, the official needs to charge a team technical foul. That is the only way to prevent the scoring team from unfairly benefitting from the illegal action.
At first I was thinking inadvertent whistle, but that would only reward the offending team. Let's go with a Player Technical for delaying the game by "Preventing the ball from being made live promptly or from being put in play" (10-4-5a).
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Old Thu Jan 31, 2019, 07:14pm
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Delay Or Prevent ...

In various delay/prevent situations after a goal scored:

If the action (throw-in plane, interfering with the ball), with more than five seconds remaining in the game, is delaying the game, go with a delay of game warning (or technical foul after prior warning). If less than five seconds remaining in the game, ignore such actions.

If the action (at any point in the game, regardless of score, or time remaining) is preventing the ball from becoming live (one example, kicking the ball into the bleachers), go directly to a technical foul, not for delay of game, but for the unsporting act of preventing the ball from becoming live (no warning needed), and tack on a delay warning in the book.

The following acts have their own rule and their own penalty, regardless of the score and time remaining in the game: Knocking the ball out of A1’s hands (technical foul), and crossing the boundary line and fouling A1 (intentional personal foul), and also tack on a delay warning in the book for either.
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Old Thu Jan 31, 2019, 07:28pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Pennsylvania Coach View Post
We had a situation recently in my chapter that I'd like some opinions on. A is trailing by 5 points. A1 makes a layup, cutting the margin to 3 points, with 4-point-something on the clock, still running. A1 grabs the ball out of the net and throws it back toward his own bench. I am aware of the specific rule/case directing the officials to ignore this delay and allow time to expire. However, at least one of the officials on this game was not aware, and blew the whistle to stop play. Now what?
See 9.2.10A. Technical foul.
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Old Thu Jan 31, 2019, 07:34pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Pennsylvania Coach View Post
We had a situation recently in my chapter that I'd like some opinions on. A is trailing by 5 points. A1 makes a layup, cutting the margin to 3 points, with 4-point-something on the clock, still running. A1 grabs the ball out of the net and throws it back toward his own bench. I am aware of the specific rule/case directing the officials to ignore this delay and allow time to expire. However, at least one of the officials on this game was not aware, and blew the whistle to stop play. Now what?

Pennsylvania Coach:

The Rule to which you allude is when Team A has yet to receive a Delay of Game Warning and A1 reaches through the Boundary Plane but does not make contact with either the Ball or B1.

That said, the Play you have described is, in my opinion, is an act which cannot be ignored even if Team A has yet to receive a Delay of Game Warning. A1's actions cannot be ignored and need to be charged and penalized.

MTD, Sr.
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Old Thu Jan 31, 2019, 07:37pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. View Post
Pennsylvania Coach:

The Rule to which you allude is when Team A has yet to receive a Delay of Game Warning and A1 reaches through the Boundary Plane but does not make contact with either the Ball or B1.

That said, the Play you have described is, in my opinion, is an act which cannot be ignored even if Team A has yet to receive a Delay of Game Warning. A1's actions cannot be ignored and need to be charged and penalized.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
See 9.2.10A. Technical foul.

Bob:

Thanks for the CB Play.

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Old Thu Jan 31, 2019, 08:53pm
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Can I guess that no T was issued and the officials just went to the POI?
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Old Thu Jan 31, 2019, 10:52pm
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Originally Posted by deecee View Post
Can I guess that no T was issued and the officials just went to the POI?
You have guessed correctly.

Thanks Bob for the casebook play.
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Old Fri Feb 01, 2019, 07:29am
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Originally Posted by A Pennsylvania Coach View Post
You have guessed correctly.

Thanks Bob for the casebook play.
I can only hope this was at least on a below varsity level game (doesn't make it right, but less on the line I suppose).
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Old Fri Feb 01, 2019, 08:03am
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Always Listen To bob ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
See 9.2.10A. Technical foul.
9.2.10 SITUATION A: A1 is out of bounds for a throw-in. B1 reaches through the boundary plane and knocks the ball out of A1’s hands. Team B has not been warned previously for a throw-in plane infraction. RULING: B1 is charged with a technical foul and it also results in the official having a team warning recorded and reported to the head coach. COMMENT: In situations with the clock running and five or less seconds left in the game, a throw-in plane violation or interfering with the ball following a goal should be ignored if its only purpose is to stop the clock. However, if the tactic in any way interferes with the thrower’s efforts to make a throw-in, a technical foul for delay shall be called even though no previous warning had been issued. In this situation, if the official stopped the clock and issued a team warning, it would allow the team to benefit from the tactic. (4-47-1; 10-1-5b, c; 10-3-10)
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Old Fri Feb 01, 2019, 08:28am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deecee View Post
I can only hope this was at least on a below varsity level game (doesn't make it right, but less on the line I suppose).
I know what you are getting at, deecee, but I'm not sure that the sub-varsity coaches and players would agree.

Last edited by LRZ; Fri Feb 01, 2019 at 08:40am.
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Old Fri Feb 01, 2019, 08:32am
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I would think that one scenario could be that if a player reaches through the plane and does not touch the ball could cause his team to steal the throw in pass as he is being allowed this pressure while we wait for the clock to run out. I guess a late whistle here after the ball is stolen could wipe out this advantage, but now you've stopped the clock again so the defense still gains an advantage.
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Old Fri Feb 01, 2019, 09:28am
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Originally Posted by LRZ View Post
I know what you are getting at, deecee, but I'm not sure that the sub-varsity coaches and players would agree.
5th grade coaches won't agree either, but it's the reality of things. Expect a big drop off between Var-->JV officials and even bigger from JV-->Fresh.

A rule mess up sub varsity won't get addressed at all unless it's absolutely catastrophic. Even at the varsity level it's rare. Until you get to college kicking rules has little to no consequences.

Assignors have little recourse as qualified officials are in short supply. I can tell you since I stopped officiating 2 years ago I haven't missed the nonsense that came with it one bit. I do miss the game. But not enough to have to start that grind back up at this point in life.
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Old Fri Feb 01, 2019, 10:06am
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It's not worth an argument--and I don't think we are really disagreeing--but I meant that to the coaches and players, there is always a lot on the line, if only because coaches and players want to see the rewards of their efforts. Sure, the skills and coaching might all be less than great, and sub-par officiating might not have career consequences, but it's still meaningful. That's why I go all out every game, regardless of the level.
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