Shooter landing on defender laying on floor

[grunewar]

Just discussed this type of play during our pre-game last night.......

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by grunewar

Just discussed this type of play during our pre-game last night.......

And so (BillyMac said with bated breath) ...

Don't give us "What happens in the locker room stays in the locker room".

[BillyMac]

If a casebook play falls in a forest and no one is around to read it, is it still a casebook play?

[LRZ]

Another, related question is how do you cite such a case to a coach? "Jack, there was a case 15 years ago that said...."

[CJP]

Originally Posted by LRZ

Another, related question is how do you cite such a case to a coach? "Jack, there was a case 15 years ago that said...."

Does 10.7.1 A cover it? Why or why not?

[LRZ]

In my opinion, 10.7.1A does not cover the OP's situation. "B1 takes a certain spot on the court..." implies intent, an intentional act that is neither accidental, as in "falls to the floor," as in 10.6.1, nor incidental during a scramble, as in the OP.

I'm much more comfortable saying to a coach, "He didn't have legal guarding position," than "There's an old case...."

[SNIPERBBB]

Originally Posted by LRZ

In my opinion, 10.7.1A does not cover the OP's situation. "B1 takes a certain spot on the court..." implies intent, an intentional act that is neither accidental, as in "falls to the floor," as in 10.6.1, nor incidental during a scramble, as in the OP.

I'm much more comfortable saying to a coach, "He didn't have legal guarding position," than "There's an old case...."

But what do you tell the coach when they ask "what did the offender do wrong?".

A contact foul has to be caused by a player doing something illegal. Falling down isn't illegal unless we are going to get into the flopping debate.

[CJP]

Originally Posted by LRZ

In my opinion, 10.7.1A does not cover the OP's situation. "B1 takes a certain spot on the court..." implies intent, an intentional act that is neither accidental, as in "falls to the floor," as in 10.6.1, nor incidental during a scramble, as in the OP.

I'm much more comfortable saying to a coach, "He didn't have legal guarding position," than "There's an old case...."

10.7.1 A supports a foul on the offense for (a) A1 landing on B1 (b) A1 charging into B1. If a player lying on the floor does not get this call, the case would make more sense if it did not have the "landing on" language.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by LRZ

In my opinion, 10.7.1A does not cover the OP's situation. "B1 takes a certain spot on the court..." implies intent, an intentional act that is neither accidental, as in "falls to the floor," as in 10.6.1, nor incidental during a scramble, as in the OP.

I'm much more comfortable saying to a coach, "He didn't have legal guarding position," than "There's an old case...."

My problem with the NFHS case play is "how much space on the floor is the defender entitled to?" If he's a 7 footer, the offensive player has to detour completely around his body? If the defender were upright, he wouldn't be entitled to spread out his arms and take up that much space. A player lying on the floor is no longer within his natural cylinder.

Can a player who is lying down set a legal screen? If 7' tall A2 is prone on the floor, and B1 is guarding A1 and B1 trips over A2, is that a legal screen?

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by LRZ

Another, related question is how do you cite such a case to a coach?

I wouldn't cite the caseplay, I would just cite the rule.

"Coach, the rule states that every player is entitled to a spot on the playing court provided such player gets there first without illegally contacting an opponent".

I could follow up with, "There's a difference between being tripped, and tripping".

I used this statement successfully in the past for a few different situations.

It seems to work.