Coach counting

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by loners4me

Would you allow a coach to count out loud? 5 sec inbounding count, backcourt and even 3 seconds. What about an assistant who says he is just coaching his players?

It would be an immediate stop sign if he's doing it because he's figured out I can't count. Then T if he does it again.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BigCat

It would be an immediate stop sign if he's doing it because he's figured out I can't count. Then T if he does it again.

I don't do stop signs, but I'm definitely shutting it down with a quiet word.

[so cal lurker]

Heard a ref say to a coach in a middle school game: "when you count out loud, I lose track and have to start over."

[Adam]

Originally Posted by so cal lurker

Heard a ref say to a coach in a middle school game: "when you count out loud, I lose track and have to start over."

A funny line, and one that might work at lower level games. Very experienced refs might be able to get away with it in a varsity game if they have an established rapport with the coach.

Newer officials should stay far far away from comments like that, though.

[RefCT]

I would stop it immediately. If their count doesn't match my count (which it probably won't), then they are also disadvantaging the other team - potentially making the other team rush because they think they are about to violate. Completely unsportsmanlike.

If the coach is doing it to trigger changes in his defense, he can figure out trigger words to communicate this without counting out loud. Hell, I wouldn't even care if he used the number on the count to trigger (i.e. at his 8 he yells 8 to trigger a trap) - just don't actively count out loud.

[bucky]

Originally Posted by RefCT

I would stop it immediately. If their count doesn't match my count (which it probably won't), then they are also disadvantaging the other team - potentially making the other team rush because they think they are about to violate. Completely unsportsmanlike.

I hear what you are saying and do not necessarily disagree. However, if you consider it "completely unsportsmanlike", how do you handle the situation of the crowd counting down a clock prematurely in an effort to influence the opponent? Maybe not the same but that certainly seems "completely unsportsmanlike" also. NBD, it is an extreme analogy and I'm not busting your chops. Just a thought I had.

[UNIgiantslayers]

Originally Posted by bucky

I hear what you are saying and do not necessarily disagree. However, if you consider it "completely unsportsmanlike", how do you handle the situation of the crowd counting down a clock prematurely in an effort to influence the opponent? Maybe not the same but that certainly seems "completely unsportsmanlike" also. NBD, it is an extreme analogy and I'm not busting your chops. Just a thought I had.

The crowd can boo me. The coach cannot.

The crowd can gesture at me. The coach cannot.

The crowd can try to disconcert a free throw shooter. The coach cannot.

The crowd can drink beer during a game. The coach cannot.

Etc.

[bucky]

Originally Posted by UNIgiantslayers

The crowd can boo me. The coach cannot.

The crowd can gesture at me. The coach cannot.

The crowd can try to disconcert a free throw shooter. The coach cannot.

The crowd can drink beer during a game. The coach cannot.

Etc.

With the exception of drinking beer, which does not occur, technically, I am not seeing differences as far as unsporting conduct in your examples.

The crowd gesturing and disconcerting (term no longer used) are examples of unsporting conduct. Would you not agree?

NFHS Rule 2-8 art. 1

A player cannot display unsporting conduct.
A coach cannot display unsporting conduct.
A substitute cannot display unsporting conduct.
A team attendant cannot display unsporting conduct.
A team follower cannot display unsporting conduct.

Sure, there is a lengthy note, and I would not penalize a crowd for booing. My point is that it is another situation where there is unsporting conduct and it is not penalized by the officials as it is written by rule. Often times it can be too difficult to pinpoint offenders whereby a coach is easier. And we have the ability to penalize a coach at times when bench offenders cannot be singled out. Just not the same with a crowd.