Time for a Rule Review?

[coachjdb]

OK...need some help from the HS stripes on this one. Recruiting for a team last week and saw this unusual play. Team A had possession of the ball at half court when player on Team B was called for a non shooting personal foul, a second later the fouled player on Team A was called for a technical foul. Two technical foul shots were taken by Team B and then they were given the ball opposite the table. I would have assumed that since the personal foul was prior to the tech that team A would have maintained the possession after the foul shots. To me this seems to be a questionable rule whereas team B received no negative effect of play as a result of the PF.

[OKREF]

Not in High School. This was handled correctly. Had team A been in the bonus they would have shot the 1-1 with the lane cleared, then shot the technical, and team B would have received the ball at the half line for a throw in.

[Smitty]

Fouls are handled in the order they occur, so this was the correct procedure (unless Team A was in the bonus - then they would have shot 1 and 1 with lane cleared before B shot their free throws for the T). Team B had their team foul count increase and the player had his/her foul count increase, so there was an effect.

[rlarry]

High school Technical fouls are different than college. The penalty is 2 shots with the ball at the division line. Since the penalty for the personal foul was possession, team A lost that possession do to the T. If it was a 1&1 or 2 shot foul, they would have shot with the lane cleared. Fouls are enforced in the order they happen.

[BryanV21]

Originally Posted by coachjdb

OK...need some help from the HS stripes on this one. Recruiting for a team last week and saw this unusual play. Team A had possession of the ball at half court when player on Team B was called for a non shooting personal foul, a second later the fouled player on Team A was called for a technical foul. Two technical foul shots were taken by Team B and then they were given the ball opposite the table. I would have assumed that since the personal foul was prior to the tech that team A would have maintained the possession after the foul shots. To me this seems to be a questionable rule whereas team B received no negative effect of play as a result of the PF.

So Team A should not lose possession of the ball after they are charged for a technical foul?

Perhaps the player on Team A should not have been an idiot and got a tech in the first place.

And chances are that technical foul was a "bigger deal" than the personal foul.

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[Smitty]

Originally Posted by BryanV21

So Team A should not lose possession of the ball after they are charged for a technical foul?

Perhaps the player on Team A should not have been an idiot and got a tech in the first place.

And chances are that technical foul was a "bigger deal" than the personal foul.

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None of this really matters - the rules give us the sequence of handling the situation. He was just asking a question not knowing how we handle the situation in HS. No need to treat him like he's a moron.

[Bad Zebra]

Originally Posted by BryanV21

....And chances are that technical foul was a "bigger deal" than the personal foul.

Maybe...but that's no basis for a rule application. I don't think there are degrees of "deals" in high school basketball. Just violations, fouls, and specific penalties for each. Don't confuse the original poster with non-relevant opinion.

[BryanV21]

Originally Posted by Smitty

None of this really matters - the rules give us the sequence of handling the situation. He was just asking a question not knowing how we handle the situation in HS. No need to treat him like he's a moron.

I'm sorry, it sounded like he understood how it was carried out, he just disagreed and was looking for a change to the rule.

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[deecee]

Originally Posted by BryanV21

So Team A should not lose possession of the ball after they are charged for a technical foul?

Perhaps the player on Team A should not have been an idiot and got a tech in the first place.

And chances are that technical foul was a "bigger deal" than the personal foul.

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He's a college coach. College T's are POI except for dead ball contact and flagrant 2 T's which are midcourt opposite the table to the offended team.

[coachjdb]

not looking for a rule review was just confirming the rule to begin with. Just seems odd that their is no effect to the course of play on the court when a personal foul is committed. I get it that there is a player/team foul but that does not address course of play. I assume this is a good rule to discourage the player from the tech in the first place. Thanks for the responses.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by coachjdb

OK...need some help from the HS stripes on this one. Recruiting for a team last week and saw this unusual play. Team A had possession of the ball at half court when player on Team B was called for a non shooting personal foul, a second later the fouled player on Team A was called for a technical foul. Two technical foul shots were taken by Team B and then they were given the ball opposite the table. I would have assumed that since the personal foul was prior to the tech that team A would have maintained the possession after the foul shots. To me this seems to be a questionable rule whereas team B received no negative effect of play as a result of the PF.

The difference between HS rules and college rules.

Team B did receive a team foul and B1 received a personal foul, that's their penalty. If Team A would have been in the bonus, they would have shot free throws, that would have been an additional penalty.

A1 needs to keep his mouth shut, especially when his opponent just got called for a foul.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BryanV21

I'm sorry, it sounded like he understood how it was carried out, he just disagreed and was looking for a change to the rule.

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He understands. He is an assistant coach from a college team based on what I can surmise from his 3 posts so far. He just needs to accept that the HS rule is different than the college rule.

[so cal lurker]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

He understands. He is an assistant coach from a college team based on what I can surmise from his 3 posts so far. He just needs to accept that the HS rule is different than the college rule.

IIRC, the college rule used to be the same as the current HS rule. In essence, college softened the consequences of certain Ts. And IIRC, it was some years after they had increased the consequences of a T by going from 1 FT to 2.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by so cal lurker

IIRC, the college rule used to be the same as the current HS rule. In essence, college softened the consequences of certain Ts. And IIRC, it was some years after they had increased the consequences of a T by going from 1 FT to 2.

I work both. All that history stuff is irrelevant to me (as you can tell in my convos with BillyMac). The college rule has been the way it now for a while now. Every time I work I make sure I'm prepared to properly adjudicate technical fouls based on that game's rule set.

[BryanV21]

Originally Posted by coachjdb

not looking for a rule review was just confirming the rule to begin with. Just seems odd that their is no effect to the course of play on the court when a personal foul is committed. I get it that there is a player/team foul but that does not address course of play. I assume this is a good rule to discourage the player from the tech in the first place. Thanks for the responses.

Sorry for the confusion

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