Please Explain This Call (Video)

[Dad]

Originally Posted by xyrph

Thanks for your response, Dad. You at least provide some insight that is helpful.

Regarding the block/forearm can you elaborate, please? Are you referring to what happens at approx. 7 seconds into the clip?

Is a defensive player not allowed to place their arm like that? I know it is a foul if she extends the arm and pushes on the offensive player, but if it is purely defensive I thought this was ok. When I look at that portion of the clip I see the offensive player pushing #4's arm and not the other way around. I'd like to know if this is indeed a foul in this situation committed by #4?

An extended arm bar is now an automatic foul on a ball handler.

A couple years ago they changed the rule from officials making the judgement on defense inhibiting the offense with hands/forearm to making it automatic.

Now an automatic foul:
1) Prolonged one hand on ball handler
2) Two hands on ball handler
3) Forearm on ball handler.
4) Lastly, which can be confusing, is the defender can hot stove touch the offense, but a second touch with either hand is an automatic foul. This doesn't mean you can touch for a second no matter what. Still a judgement call if the hot stove touch gives the defense an advantage.

[SC Official]

When you come on this forum imposing questions and making statements that sound like fanboy talk, expect to be treated like a fanboy.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BDevil15

Maybe he is genuinely looking for some insight. Fans are generally the most ignorant population in the gym and maybe he is just looking for some help understanding what a ref might see.

Yes I'm feeling glass half full today.

Call was missed, pure and simple. That's been acknowledged from the first response. One official is wearing a watch, another is a teenager; this isn't a Final Four crew. What the hell does he hope to accomplish other than embarrass the official who missed the call. There is no insight to be gained. He didn't come here asking about his daughter's forearm and whether it was legal. That would be a legitimate reason to post the video and would be HELPFUL and constructive conversation.

He came here for one reason, to whine about a missed call involving his daughter. I guess the whole officiating community is supposed to give him a collective apology for the injustice.

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

He came here for one reason, to whine about a missed call involving his daughter. I guess the whole officiating community is supposed to give him a collective apology for the injustice.

Yep.

[xyrph]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Call was missed, pure and simple. That's been acknowledged from the first response. One official is wearing a watch, another is a teenager; this isn't a Final Four crew. What the hell does he hope to accomplish other than embarrass the official who missed the call. There is no insight to be gained. He didn't come here asking about his daughter's forearm and whether it was legal. That would be a legitimate reason to post the video and would be HELPFUL and constructive conversation.

He came here for one reason, to whine about a missed call involving his daughter. I guess the whole officiating community is supposed to give him a collective apology for the injustice.

Hello! I am asking about the arm bar.

Dad gave some good information but the part about the "extended" arm does not seem to apply in the scenario at about 7 to 8 seconds in and so I'm still unclear.

[Dad]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Call was missed, pure and simple. That's been acknowledged from the first response. One official is wearing a watch, another is a teenager; this isn't a Final Four crew. What the hell does he hope to accomplish other than embarrass the official who missed the call. There is no insight to be gained. He didn't come here asking about his daughter's forearm and whether it was legal. That would be a legitimate reason to post the video and would be HELPFUL and constructive conversation.

He came here for one reason, to whine about a missed call involving his daughter. I guess the whole officiating community is supposed to give him a collective apology for the injustice.

You're basically asking a three year old to act like an adult. This is in no way meant to be offensive, but I just think of them as TypicalIdiotFans and my life is much easier. Without fans, sports wouldn't be what they are and the games wouldn't be fun, at least for me. They are a major part of the event, whether you like it or not. Treating fans like they should know everything is just as ignorant as the fan screaming, "over the back!!"

I've changed basketball in my area for fans by treating them like human beings who don't have a clue what's going on behind the mind of an official. I can't put a price on how rewarding it is to have fans actually understanding the game instead of telling them to shut up because they're throwing a temper tantrum. What else can they do? They have a three year old mentality when it comes to the rules of the game and have no idea how to act. Answer a few questions here and there and it has a chain reaction.

[Dad]

Originally Posted by xyrph

Hello! I am asking about the arm bar.

Dad gave some good information but the part about the "extended" arm does not seem to apply in the scenario at about 7 to 8 seconds in and so I'm still unclear.

^ Answered a few posts above

[JRutledge]

I can explain it perfectly, it is girls basketball.

We can end this topic now.

Peace

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by xyrph

Hello! I am asking about the arm bar.

You are?

In the title to the thread you ask us to "please explain this call." And your first post is about "a foul called on #4."

The foul that was called was pretty clearly a foul, imho. And, I have no problem with passing on any of the other contact I saw (just from the one clip and assuming there was no other action / calls in the game that would lead to making one of these "tighter" calls).

It is very close to a BC violation on red. I didn't go back and check the video in detail to see if it should have been a violation or not.

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I can explain it perfectly, it is girls basketball.

We can end this topic now.

Peace

Hey now! Some of us less fortunate referees don't have the choice of not working girls basketball.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Dad

You're basically asking a three year old to act like an adult. This is in no way meant to be offensive, but I just think of them as TypicalIdiotFans and my life is much easier. Without fans, sports wouldn't be what they are and the games wouldn't be fun, at least for me. They are a major part of the event, whether you like it or not. Treating fans like they should know everything is just as ignorant as the fan screaming, "over the back!!"
...

We've had plenty of coaches and fans come here and ask questions. Believe it or not I actually know people who are fans. I even work with some them

It's not some new concept for me to talk to fans about officiating. This, however, is an officiating forum. It's an adult forum. Posting like a fanboy will get you treated as such.

His daughter was charged with a foul after falling on top of an opponent. Unfortunately calling official missed the first foul that caused his daughter to fall. Again, I ask, what is hoped to be learned from the posting of this video?

This right here is all I need to know about this person's motives:

...This wrong call happened literally directly in front of the ref. The only way to miss it was with eyes closed.

I can tell you what is frustrating from a parents perspective is that most refs have zero humility, and act as if they are never ever wrong. Around here they do not answer questions.

In this particular case the woman ref comes over pronouncing that this "foul" was white #4's 5th foul and the removed her from the game. Turns out it was only her fourth foul and they corrected it a few minutes later, allowing her back in after critical moment of the game had transpired.

And, all four of her "fouls" were just as obviously suspect.

[Dad]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

We've had plenty of coaches and fans come here and ask questions. Believe it or not I actually know people who are fans. I even work with some them

It's not some new concept for me to talk to fans about officiating. This, however, is an officiating forum. It's an adult forum. Posting like a fanboy will get you treated as such.

His daughter was charged with a foul after falling on top of an opponent. Unfortunately calling official missed the first foul that caused his daughter to fall. Again, I ask, what is hoped to be learned from the posting of this video?

This right here is all I need to know about this person's motives:

As I said, temper tantrum.

Hehehe.

Good point about time and place.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by SC Official

Hey now! Some of us less fortunate referees don't have the choice of not working girls basketball.

Not a comment about the officials per say, it is just a raggedy play that has players falling over each other. That is all the explanation you need and the officials has to make a call. The official could have called just about anything and someone would be here wanting us to explain it to him or her.

BTW, what the hell does the official have on his wrist?

Peace

[JRutledge]

I also think the wrong official made the call here. This should have been something the C could have seen. I think the New Lead, turned Trail saw the last thing because he was straightlined. I do not blame him, we have players on top of each other and he missed the first action with all the back and forth. We even had a missed BC violation too.

A lot going on during this play.

Peace

[Dad]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Not a comment about the officials per say, it is just a raggedy play that has players falling over each other. That is all the explanation you need and the officials has to make a call. The official could have called just about anything and someone would be here wanting us to explain it to him or her.

BTW, what the hell does the official have on his wrist?

Peace

Maybe he has a heart problem and has to watch his pulse.