Held ball during AP throw in

[BlueDevilRef]

I think this sucks. If nothing else has happened (fouls etc), this just punishes team B for playing astute throw in defense. If team A thrower in holds ball over the playing surface and you tie it up 15 times, they get to keep the ball each time it happens? Chalk this up to one of the worst rules of basketball


I wish I had a cool signature

[RefsNCoaches]

Originally Posted by BlueDevilRef

I think this sucks. If nothing else has happened (fouls etc), this just punishes team B for playing astute throw in defense. If team A thrower in holds ball over the playing surface and you tie it up 15 times, they get to keep the ball each time it happens? Chalk this up to one of the worst rules of basketball


I wish I had a cool signature

I agree...you would think that since B is legally in bounds and the ball has now touched a player in-bounds, the throw in SHOULD end. Maybe something for a rules change in the future

[just another ref]

All this is logical, but how many times have any of you ever seen this happen? Change the rule, (if anybody knew about it, but they wouldn't) and it encourages the defender to be more active in reaching for the ball, which would result in more technical and intentional fouls.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BlueDevilRef

I think this sucks. If nothing else has happened (fouls etc), this just punishes team B for playing astute throw in defense. If team A thrower in holds ball over the playing surface and you tie it up 15 times, they get to keep the ball each time it happens? Chalk this up to one of the worst rules of basketball


I wish I had a cool signature

I think the rule is fine. If you push the thrower back (or sometimes the defender) a little so this is not an issue, you do not have to worry about this even taking place.

I do not think it is enough of a big deal to even change the rule or interpretation.

Peace

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BlueDevilRef

I think this sucks. If nothing else has happened (fouls etc), this just punishes team B for playing astute throw in defense. If team A thrower in holds ball over the playing surface and you tie it up 15 times, they get to keep the ball each time it happens? Chalk this up to one of the worst rules of basketball


I wish I had a cool signature

If the defense had played so well, they would have taken the ball from the thrower. Instead, they only shared possession of the ball. They only got it half way. AP arrow is the right thing to do.

Plus, if they do it 15 times in a row, I'm buying a lottery ticket that day and will win the big prize!

[BryanV21]

If this is the worst rule ever, then I'd say the basketball rules committee has done a pretty damn good job, because this is something that you could go your entire officiating career and not see happen.

[crosscountry55]

Originally Posted by BryanV21

If this is the worst rule ever, then I'd say the basketball rules committee has done a pretty damn good job, because this is something that you could go your entire officiating career and not see happen.

I came close. I ruled a held ball in a situation like this, but the original throw-in was not an AP throw-in.

And even that I have only seen once in 7+ years.

And yes, of course it was a 7th grade girls game. I mean, seriously....where else?

[HokiePaul]

Originally Posted by BlueDevilRef

I think this sucks. If nothing else has happened (fouls etc), this just punishes team B for playing astute throw in defense. If team A thrower in holds ball over the playing surface and you tie it up 15 times, they get to keep the ball each time it happens? Chalk this up to one of the worst rules of basketball


I wish I had a cool signature

I think the rule that team A would keep the alternating possesion arrow if they commit a foul before the throw-in if completed seems more strange than the held ball situation (especially given that team A would lose the arrow for a violation).

That situatuation does actually happen every once in a while and almost always requires a trip to the table after the throw in for the foul to tell them to put the arrow back to the offensive team.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BlueDevilRef

I think this sucks. If nothing else has happened (fouls etc), this just punishes team B for playing astute throw in defense. If team A thrower in holds ball over the playing surface and you tie it up 15 times, they get to keep the ball each time it happens? Chalk this up to one of the worst rules of basketball


I wish I had a cool signature

How are they punished? Did someone take 30 lashes?

For the record, I advocate for switching the arrow when it's handed to the thrower, but I'm such a minority on that I have come to accept it will never happen.

[SNIPERBBB]

Has this case book play changed, I seem to remember a different ruling several years ago?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by SNIPERBBB

Has this case book play changed, I seem to remember a different ruling several years ago?

I don't think it has changed.

[SNIPERBBB]

Im thinking it might of been before the change to the AP throw-in rule.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by SNIPERBBB

Has this case book play changed, I seem to remember a different ruling several years ago?

In Iowa, before the two governing bodies started working towards making their rules the same, the Girls' Union had a modification that changed the arrow on an AP throw in as soon as the ball was handed to the thrower. I don't know if other states had such modifications at one time, but as far as I'm aware the NFHS has never been different.

[frezer11]

There is actually a third scenario that ends the throw in, and it directly relates to this. If instead of tying the ball up, the team B player simply pulls the ball away from the offense, then he has gained possession and the throw in has subsequent ended. The ball was not thrown in bounds, nor did the offense violate.

A related question, can the thrower in reach the ball across the in bound plane, and hand the ball off to a teammate just over the line? My immediate thought is no, and I think I could probably support that with the rules, but why is a defender allowed to grab the ball in that same scenario legally and play on? Shouldn't the same rules apply to both teams here?

[deecee]

Originally Posted by frezer11

There is actually a third scenario that ends the throw in, and it directly relates to this. If instead of tying the ball up, the team B player simply pulls the ball away from the offense, then he has gained possession and the throw in has subsequent ended. The ball was not thrown in bounds, nor did the offense violate.

A related question, can the thrower in reach the ball across the in bound plane, and hand the ball off to a teammate just over the line? My immediate thought is no, and I think I could probably support that with the rules, but why is a defender allowed to grab the ball in that same scenario legally and play on? Shouldn't the same rules apply to both teams here?

Do you have rules or caseplay that support the part in red?

Where in the rules is the bold supported? We only have support for a held ball, there is none for a "steal".