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Old Mon Jul 28, 2014, 01:12pm
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Double set position for the pitcher?

So Im watching an American Legion state championship game last night and the home teams left handed pitcher was definitely making a double set. There was a 3 man umpire crew on calling this game. The pitchers first set to a stop comes about equal to his mouth. His second set came to a stop, more than a few times it was rolled through, was just below his shoulders. No balk was ever called.

While Im watching the game in the 4th inning the head of umpires walks up to me and I bring his attention to the pitcher and this "double set". The pitcher does it again, I was told that was marginal. I said "keep watching." The next pitch he said to me "now that was a balk." I told him to watch and see if he rolls through the lower set postion, which he did. His next comment was "now that's another balk."

In a close game we had runners on third and on first base, this action that was being ignored was definitely decieving our runners on first.

So my question is do you call the balk after the first inning or do you let the pitcher to continue to abuse it and get the unfair advantage?

The head of umpires told me if they didn't call it by the 2nd inning that it wouldn't be called.
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Old Mon Jul 28, 2014, 01:37pm
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Of course this is a HTBT situation but, just because it is the Championship game, doesn't always mean Championship caliber officials are working it.

Which is the assignor's fault.

The good Ole Boy system is still alive and well in many, many areas.
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Old Mon Jul 28, 2014, 01:59pm
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Originally Posted by Brblueump44 View Post
So my question is do you call the balk after the first inning or do you let the pitcher to continue to abuse it and get the unfair advantage?
Depends. If I missed it the first time, I'll try to get it the next.

But if I judged it to be legal the first time, then I'll judge it to be legal the next. Your judgment and my judgment might be different of course.

And, what was your role in this? Fan? Coach? Either way, I don't think the "head of umpires" should be talking to almost anyone during the game.
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Old Mon Jul 28, 2014, 02:39pm
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Head of Umpires...

UIC or TD?
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Old Mon Jul 28, 2014, 05:24pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brblueump44 View Post
So Im watching an American Legion state championship game last night and the home teams left handed pitcher was definitely making a double set. There was a 3 man umpire crew on calling this game. The pitchers first set to a stop comes about equal to his mouth. His second set came to a stop, more than a few times it was rolled through, was just below his shoulders. No balk was ever called.

While Im watching the game in the 4th inning the head of umpires walks up to me and I bring his attention to the pitcher and this "double set". The pitcher does it again, I was told that was marginal. I said "keep watching." The next pitch he said to me "now that was a balk." I told him to watch and see if he rolls through the lower set postion, which he did. His next comment was "now that's another balk."

In a close game we had runners on third and on first base, this action that was being ignored was definitely decieving our runners on first.

So my question is do you call the balk after the first inning or do you let the pitcher to continue to abuse it and get the unfair advantage?

The head of umpires told me if they didn't call it by the 2nd inning that it wouldn't be called.
It was none of your business what they called or didn't call. You just threw your BROTHERS under the bus! And you were a spectator at that. If I was on the crew, and found out about this, we would have come to Jesus meeting!
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Old Tue Jul 29, 2014, 08:08pm
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Originally Posted by Brblueump44 View Post
I told him to watch and see if he rolls through the lower set postion, which he did.
He stopped, then "rolled through" a second stop? Pitchers do that all the time. It's called a "pitch" or "delivery".
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Old Tue Jul 29, 2014, 09:56pm
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Originally Posted by Publius View Post
He stopped, then "rolled through" a second stop? Pitchers do that all the time. It's called a "pitch" or "delivery".
When we let them get away with a "double" stop, being that we see a wiggle or whatever at the top, we should enforce the stop at the bottom. When pitchers do this with R1 they will try to cheat at the bottom. With R2 they don't cheat.
But, I'm amazed that a coach has never sent a runner at the top stop and pushed the issue.
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Old Tue Jul 29, 2014, 10:28pm
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So three umpires and the entire opposing team didn't notice it or care. Right? So just maybe it's not a balk.
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Old Wed Jul 30, 2014, 10:36am
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Originally Posted by Rich Ives View Post
So three umpires and the entire opposing team didn't notice it or care. Right? So just maybe it's not a balk.
Come on, Rich! You know that you can see everything better from the stands, don't you?
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Old Wed Jul 30, 2014, 11:36am
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Originally Posted by ozzy6900 View Post
Come on, Rich! You know that you can see everything better from the stands, don't you?
Folks can coach better from the stands too.
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Old Thu Jul 31, 2014, 10:26am
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Folks can coach better from the stands too.
LOL!!! You're absolutely right!
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Old Thu Jul 31, 2014, 11:29am
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!

Screen Name: Brblueump44

Quote from Post: " . . . we had runners on third and on first base, this action that was being ignored was definitely decieving our runners on first.

My Call: Fan Boy.
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Old Thu Jul 31, 2014, 08:40pm
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Im with Rich on this one. Over the years, i have found that i call less & less balks at the higher levels. Given the situation as described, I may have discussed the move with one of my other partners in between innings to get his thoughts on it. If no one's complaining and the pitcher is not purposely doing it to keep the runner from getting a good jump, then I may just take a pass on it. Im not a big fan of calling balks that everyone in the house is wondering why you called a balk. If at all possible, i like to get balks early in the game and when it doesnt cost the team dearly. Obviously, that's not always the case but im not one to unecessarily interject myself into the game to showcase my strict interpretation of the balk rule. I'll sit back now and wait to get flamed by the rule book umpires :-o
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Old Thu Jul 31, 2014, 09:56pm
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I have found that doing higher level baseball usually HAS less balks therefore, there are less to call. But, I am certainly not waiting for complaints in order to start calling balks. If you have to discuss whether or not a balk occurred, then obviously you are not up on what is, or is not a balk.

I don't believe this has anything to do about being a rule book umpire either, it is about doing your job. You are paid to umpire and know the rules, and enforce the penalties, when there is violation observed. Not when you feel like it.

Now I am not trying to come across as an ahole however, you can still be a nice guy and not interject yourself into the game but, do the job you are getting paid for.
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