batwarmer

[MikeStrybel]

Originally Posted by Rich Ives

Is a bat used in 90 degree F ambient OK but a bat warmed to 90 degrees F on a 40 degree F day not?

If so, why?

You answered your own question. Having to apply an artificial source of heat to the bat is an attempt to gain an advantage. As the father of a young pitcher, I see this as dangerous cheating.

[kylejt]

I'm sure your answer would be different if your son were a catcher or umpire, and an ice cold metal bat were be swung in front of their face.

[MikeStrybel]

Originally Posted by kylejt

I'm sure your answer would be different if your son were a catcher or umpire, and an ice cold metal bat were be swung in front of their face.

With all due respect, your inference is irrelevant. Living in the Chicago suburbs, our seasons begin cold. He faces cold bats all of the time and is learning how to respond to balls hit from them. If a bat has been artificially warmed on such a day, the bat will react differently. That IS what the companies show in their studies, after all...and why they are considered illegal for HS baseball, where safety rules the day.

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by MikeStrybel

With all due respect, your inference is irrelevant. Living in the Chicago suburbs, our seasons begin cold. He faces cold bats all of the time and is learning how to respond to balls hit from them. If a bat has been artificially warmed on such a day, the bat will react differently. That IS what the companies show in their studies, after all...and why they are considered illegal for HS baseball, where safety rules the day.

It depends how cold it actually is. I play softball from the beginning of February to the end of October in Texas. When the weather is cooler, not cold, the air is thinner here, the ball will fly further, and with more velocity than in the hot, hot summer months. Most ball fields around here are bottom land (land that is close to rivers and creeks), and generally not used for development. Bat manufacturers recommend not to use some bats below a certain temperature. The reason, bats will become harder (contract), and become brittle which increases the chances of the bat breaking. A bat warmer will maybe/maybe not make the bat less susceptible to breaking. I think it is more of a gimmick, than an advantage to a hitter. Excessive heat will make a bat expand, thus more susceptible to breakage, also.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Steven Tyler

When the weather is cooler, not cold, the air is thinner here,

Uh, no.

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by Matt

Uh, no.

Yeah, pretty much. When it's what we call cold here, the wind is usually blowing hard out the north or northwest, and the humidity is higher. We get a wet cold most the time. With global warming, winter is almost a thing of the past here.

I wear shorts most the year, and very seldom a jacket. Mostly a long sleeve t-shirt with some pants, usually just a pair of workout pullovers. I'm not out in it as often as I used to be. The only time I need to dress warm is if I'll be out in the colder weather for an extended time, or the wind is blowing.

We very seldom get down under 40% humidity in our cold season. In the bottoms, the air is cooler at night depending on the time of year. In the Red River Valley which is close to the Texas/Oklahoma state line. You can go to bed at 10:00 PM with a window open and no cover. About 2:00 AM, you will wake up shivering, and need a sheet and a blanket. We get about six months of summer. Throw in a summer of drought, and it's even hotter.

Humidity is a b*tch. I was out in Phoenix at the end of October with temps in the low 90's, and I didn't break into the same type sweat if it was the low 90's here. In fact, I probably over-hydrated. We finished playing ball on a Saturday night, and started driving back about noon Sunday (MST in Arizona as they don't use DST there). I had to stop to pee at about every truck stop from Phoenix to the New Mexico state line.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Steven Tyler

Yeah, pretty much. When it's what we call cold here, the wind is usually blowing hard out the north or northwest, and the humidity is higher. We get a wet cold most the time. With global warming, winter is almost a thing of the past here.

I wear shorts most the year, and very seldom a jacket. Mostly a long sleeve t-shirt with some pants, usually just a pair of workout pullovers. I'm not out in it as often as I used to be. The only time I need to dress warm is if I'll be out in the colder weather for an extended time, or the wind is blowing.

We very seldom get down under 40% humidity in our cold season. In the bottoms, the air is cooler at night depending on the time of year. In the Red River Valley which is close to the Texas/Oklahoma state line. You can go to bed at 10:00 PM with a window open and no cover. About 2:00 AM, you will wake up shivering, and need a sheet and a blanket. We get about six months of summer. Throw in a summer of drought, and it's even hotter.

Humidity is a b*tch. I was out in Phoenix at the end of October with temps in the low 90's, and I didn't break into the same type sweat if it was the low 90's here. In fact, I probably over-hydrated. We finished playing ball on a Saturday night, and started driving back about noon Sunday (MST in Arizona as they don't use DST there). I had to stop to pee at about every truck stop from Phoenix to the New Mexico state line.

The "no" referred to the idea that colder air is thinner. Where you are, it makes no difference.

[Steven Tyler]

These things came in vogue about 10 years ago when all the bats got so expensive. While a bat will contract or expand slightly in hot and cold weather, it still isn't noticeable to the naked eye. It does however damage the sturdiness of the material it is made of.

The senior softball bats that are made of a carbon shell will show what will look like a little scratch on the "painted" part. A few swings later it will look like the fender of an old Corvette that was slightly bumped into.

I suggest that you always store your umpire or sports equipment at room temperature to protect it from elements like extreme heat or cold.

[Rich Ives]

Originally Posted by MikeStrybel

You answered your own question. Having to apply an artificial source of heat to the bat is an attempt to gain an advantage. As the father of a young pitcher, I see this as dangerous cheating.

It's not dangerous because the bat would be at the same temperature it would be on a normal 90 degree day.

Or is playing on a 90 degree day dangerous?

[kylejt]

I fully understand Mike's concern, if heating up a bat would make it perform beyond it's ratings, and not just up to it.

Which begs the next question: Do testing facilities ever test at different temperatures? I'm guessing they don't.

[jicecone]

Originally Posted by kylejt

I fully understand Mike's concern, if heating up a bat would make it perform beyond it's ratings, and not just up to it.

Which begs the next question: Do testing facilities ever test at different temperatures? I'm guessing they don't.

Any testing lab that does'nt, certainlly isn't one I would want to certify my product though.

By the way, I did a 12 inning HS scrimmage yesterday and one team used wood bats and the other BBCOR certified alluminum. 75 deg for entire game and one school was State Champions last year and the other was fairly matched in talent. Not sure if it was all bat performance or early season player performance however this was not a slugging contest. Many players commented about getting good contact with BBCOR, seems to be more important with the new bats, rather than any type of contact. Just under 3 hours for entire scrimmage. Three of us rotated 4 innings each on the dish. If this is any indications of the upcoming season. It works for me.

[Cobra]

Originally Posted by kylejt

I fully understand Mike's concern, if heating up a bat would make it perform beyond it's ratings, and not just up to it.

Which begs the next question: Do testing facilities ever test at different temperatures? I'm guessing they don't.

Begs the question is not the same as "makes me wonder" or "raises the question". Begs the question actually begs a specific question, one cannot just make up any old question that is being begged. The question that is being begged is "what is the support for your argument?"

Begs the question is used when an argument is circular and makes no sense or is invalid.

Person 1: "This food is tasty because it is delicious."
Person 2: "That begs the question."

Tasty and delicious basically mean the same thing. Saying that something is tasty because it is delicious is not a valid argument. This begs the question. Person 1 must better support their argument about why the food is tasty.

[kylejt]

Originally Posted by Cobra

Begs the question is not the same as "makes me wonder" or "raises the question". Begs the question actually begs a specific question, one cannot just make up any old question that is being begged. The question that is being begged is "what is the support for your argument?"

Begs the question is used when an argument is circular and makes no sense or is invalid.

Person 1: "This food is tasty because it is delicious."
Person 2: "That begs the question."

Tasty and delicious basically mean the same thing. Saying that something is tasty because it is delicious is not a valid argument. This begs the question. Person 1 must better support their argument about why the food is tasty.

I beg your pardon.

(I wonder what your plate conferences are like)

[jkumpire]

... Only if I can use it in between innings to warm my hands on a cold day when I have the plate. Other than that they should be illegal....

[BretMan]

Originally Posted by kylejt

I beg your pardon.

(I wonder what your plate conferences are like)

Using "begs the question" improperly is just one of those common grammatical glitches, like saying, "I could care less", when you really mean, "I couldn't care less". Google the phrase. You'll find more than you ever wanted to know about it's usage.