Does the run score?

[TwoBits]

FED, R3, 2 outs, 2 strikes on the batter. Pitcher in windup position not paying attention to R3. R3 takes off for home. Pitcher begins windup, but R3 has just a huge jump that he crosses home plate before the ball gets to the batter. The batter watches the pitch right down the middle of the strike zone for strike three.

Score it or not?

[UmpJM]

TwoBits,

No, the run does not score.

However, the R3 has a MAJOR contract in his future.

JM

[bossman72]

As JM says, no score. Batter was 3rd out before reaching first base.

[johnnyg08]

nice question...no run...see bossman72 and others

[mick]

Originally Posted by bossman72

As JM says, no score. Batter was 3rd out before reaching first base.

Could you reference that for me, please?

I see 9.1.1 Situation G where the batter strikes before the runner crosses, but I don't know why the run doesn't count when the runner crossed before strike 3.
Seems like the run should count to me. What am I missing?

[UmpJM]

mick,

It goes to the definiton of "a play" as used in 4.09(b)Ex.(1):

4.09 HOW A TEAM SCORES.

(a) One run shall be scored each time a runner legally advances to and touches first, second, third and home base before three men are put out to end the inning. EXCEPTION: A run is not scored if the runner advances to home base during a play in which the third out is made (1) by the batter-runner before he touches first base; ...

Now though the rules use "a play" in a number of different ways, the text of the rules never defines it.

In this context, the universal interpretation is that "a play" begins when the pitcher initiates his delivery. Since the BR did not reach 1B safely, and it was the 3rd out, and the runner occupied 3B when the play began, his run does not score.

Likewise, if somehow the batter had hit a fly ball (without killing the R3) instead of striking out, and the ball were caught with less than 2 outs, the runner would be under a 7.10(a) retouch obligation.

JM

[mick]

Originally Posted by UmpJM (nee CoachJM)

mick,

It goes to the definiton of "a play" as used in 4.09(b)Ex.(1):



Now though the rules use "a play" in a number of different ways, the text of the rules never defines it.

In this context, the universal interpretation is that "a play" begins when the pitcher initiates his delivery. Since the BR did not reach 1B safely, and it was the 3rd out, and the runner occupied 3B when the play began, his run does not score.

Likewise, if somehow the batter had hit a fly ball (without killing the R3) instead of striking out, and the ball were caught with less than 2 outs, the runner would be under a 7.10(a) retouch obligation.

JM

Thanks, JM, but ...

From a 1995 J/R:

It is a play if there is a
(1) tag or tag try of a runner
(2) tag or tag try of a base
(3) throw to another fielder in a try to put out a runner
(4) rundown, or
(5) balk.

I understand that MLB and Fed will vary, but a pitch being considered a play must be related only to Fed (if it really is) and not to levels above [MLB] or below [LL].