Unusual occurence in April 28th Baltimore-Cleveland game

[SAump]

I find it hard to believe that the run was wiped off the board.

Originally Posted by Rule 2.00

A FORCE PLAY is a play in which a runner legally loses his right to occupy a base by reason of the batter becoming a runner.

Example: Not a force out. One out. Runner on first and third. Batter flies out. Two out. Runner on third tags up and scores. Runner on first tries to retouch before throw from fielder reaches first baseman, but does not get back in time and is out. Three outs. If, in umpire’s judgment, the runner from third touched home before the ball was held at first base, the run counts.

Something must have been said that we have all missed.

[Dave Hensley]

Occam's razor. The simplest explanation is the right explanation.

They screwed up. They admitted it. They had a "brain cramp."

[DG]

I will play commissioner for a moment.

A manager cannot protest an alleged misapplication of a rule after a subsequent pitch or play. The protest was made after the "correction" of a misapplication of a rule in an earlier inning. This "correction" may be allowed under 9.01c (yes, I know many here don't believe in 9.01c since all things should be covered, but apparently not). The disputed correction may be allowed under 9.01C, the original ruling is ruled incorrect, the affect did not significantly affect the protesting team's opportunity to win the game so protest is denied.

[kylejt]

If you're the commish, allow me to be the protesting manager.

There was no ruling on this play to protest. The ruling was the run didn't score before the appeal at first was made. There was no misapplication of the rules, just a very, very poor judgment call on a timing play. If my opposing manager didn't catch this, it's his fault.

Don't let the fifth umpire, with access to instant replay, have any say in this at all. Do that, and you'll have every judgment call being reviewed in the tunnel. Commish, you've got the stopper to put on the bottle before the genie comes out. Put a cork in it Boss.

My protest involves the umpires on the field inappropriately going to video tape to review a judgment call. This ain't hockey, and no one threw a red flag. This is baseball, and we have long and storied history of umpires making, and living with bad calls.

Thank you for your time.

[jkumpire]

He's nuts!

It is almost a sure thing that politics will lead to the protest being disallowed (MLB will sweep the mistake under the rug), but this protest needs to be upheld.

Sorry men, this is not a judgement call, it is clearly a misapplication of a rule, and while 9.01 covers everything in the rules, you cannot go back and retroactively change calls from previous innings.

Whatever the final score of the game is, it is irrelevant, unless Cleveland, the offended team, had won the game. It violates a simple rule of fair play to add a run several innings later in the game, mistake or not by PU. It not only changes how the game is played, it makes the whole idea of fair play questionable if you allow this to happen.

In the NFL, NBA, and NHL, it seems like almost every week there is a letter to some team from the league office about how the officials missed applied a rule. I never see the officials decide to correct an error five plays or a quarter later. It's always a case of "Our bad, sorry, see you later."

I feel awful bad for the umpire crew here, they would never want to make a mistake like this, and they have enough garbage from people to deal with. But you cannot have 2 bites of the apple in this play, especially when the next bite is 3 innigns later.

[David B]

Originally Posted by jkumpire

He's nuts!

It is almost a sure thing that politics will lead to the protest being disallowed (MLB will sweep the mistake under the rug), but this protest needs to be upheld.

Sorry men, this is not a judgement call, it is clearly a misapplication of a rule, and while 9.01 covers everything in the rules, you cannot go back and retroactively change calls from previous innings.

Whatever the final score of the game is, it is irrelevant, unless Cleveland, the offended team, had won the game. It violates a simple rule of fair play to add a run several innings later in the game, mistake or not by PU. It not only changes how the game is played, it makes the whole idea of fair play questionable if you allow this to happen.

In the NFL, NBA, and NHL, it seems like almost every week there is a letter to some team from the league office about how the officials missed applied a rule. I never see the officials decide to correct an error five plays or a quarter later. It's always a case of "Our bad, sorry, see you later."

I feel awful bad for the umpire crew here, they would never want to make a mistake like this, and they have enough garbage from people to deal with. But you cannot have 2 bites of the apple in this play, especially when the next bite is 3 innigns later.

John, won't work in basketball, they allow for it in the rules.

Actually happens all the time - one team complains about the score. Officials get together and fix it etc., Of course they have to have evidence that the score should be changed etc.,

Especially at HS level.

thanks
David

[UMP25]

Originally Posted by jkumpire

Sorry men, this is not a judgement call, it is clearly a misapplication of a rule, and while 9.01 covers everything in the rules, you cannot go back and retroactively change calls from previous innings.

Is a "call" being changed? A run that legally scored by rule wasn't properly reflected on the scoreboard and was added later.

[kylejt]

Originally Posted by UMP25

Is a "call" being changed? A run that legally scored by rule wasn't properly reflected on the scoreboard and was added later.

Ah, the crux of the whole discussion. The PU ruled that the run didn't cross the plate before the appeal was made. Thus, the wave off. The PU looked to the scoring booth, pointed to the plate, and waved it off. We all know now, because we saw the replay, that that wasn't the case. But that was the judgement call on the field at the time.