balk using mlb rules

[yankeesfan]

in a summer league i work they use mlb rules. what is the proper mechanic when a balk occurs since it is not an immediate dead ball unlike fed where it is dead immediately? also, i had this play happen. runner on 1st takes off to 2nd and pitcher throws to second base without stepping off the rubber. obviously this is a balk, but should you let this play go until play is over or kill it immediately?

[BigUmp56]

The OBR proper balk mechanic is to point at the pitcher and yell "that's a balk." Then you wait to see if he delivers the ball. If he doesn't you call "time." If he does deliver the ball you wait to see if the ball is put in play by the batter. If the batter doesn't hit the ball you then call "time" and enforce the balk.


A pitcher can throw to second base with a runner advancing without disengaging as long as he does it legally, so without more information I wouldn't say this is an "obvious balk."


Tim.

[yankeesfan]

A pitcher can throw to second base with a runner advancing without disengaging as long as he does it legally, so without more information I wouldn't say this is an "obvious balk."


Tim.[/QUOTE]

can you please give me an example? thank you for the reply. in my situation the pitcher was in the stretch, came set, turned and threw it to second base.

[DG]

Originally Posted by yankeesfan

A pitcher can throw to second base with a runner advancing without disengaging as long as he does it legally, so without more information I wouldn't say this is an "obvious balk."


Tim.

can you please give me an example? thank you for the reply. in my situation the pitcher was in the stretch, came set, turned and threw it to second base.[/QUOTE]

In this situation a legal throw to 2B would look just like an attempted pickoff with a runner on 2B.

[UmpJM]

yankeesfan,

In terms of the proper mechanic under OBR rules, I believe that Tim has given you a good description of the proper mechanic.

This is what the MLBUM says:

7.5 BALK REGULATIONS
A balk shall be called audibly ("Balk!" or "That's a balk!") and by pointing laterally at the pitcher. However, the ball is not dead automatically when this call is made. The ball becomes dead only when the umpire calls "Time" following the call of balk, and the call of "Time" is to be made only when play stops (i.e., when it is apparent that all runners including the batter runner
will not advance one base).

As Tim suggests, if the pitcher delivers a pitch following the Balk call, you leave the ball live. The same is true if you balk a pitcher on a pick-off move and he makes a "throw" (as opposed to a pitch).

I also agree with Tim that what you described is not a balk. While the pitcher certainly could have balked while making this move, you didn't describe anything that is a balk.

I believe the most relevant rule is:

8.05
If there is a runner, or runners, it is a balk when_ ...(d) The pitcher, while touching his plate, throws, or feints a throw to an unoccupied base, except for the purpose of making a play;...

If I understand you correctly, 2B was unoccupied at the time of the move and the R1 was attempting to steal 2B (in your judgement as the umpire). If that is correct, per 8.05(d), it is not a balk for the "in contact" pitcher to make a throw to 2B because he is legitimately doing so "...for the purpose of making a play...".

There are any number of things the pitcher might have done which would be legitimately balked in this situation.

For example, if the pitcher initiated a pick-off move to 1B, and then, seeing the runner had already committed to his attempt at 2B, "aborted" that move and threw to 2B, that would certainly be properly balked. On the other hand, if his move to 2B was smooth/continuous, he is perfectly legal. (And I, for one, am impressed, I might add.)

Unless, of course, you (as the umpire) judged that the R1 was only feinting an attempt to advance. Then his move/throw to 2B would be a balk, per 8.05(d).

Make sense?

JM

[yankeesfan]

i really thought you can't throw to an unoccupied base without stepping off the rubber. are you sure about this?

[RPatrino]

Yankeesfan, the key is "for the purpose of making a play". So, if the pitcher sees R1 breaking for second and throws there with the intent to make a play on R1, there is no balk.

However, if the runner takes 2 steps and returns to 1b.... "THATS A BALK"...

Bob P.

[BigUmp56]

He's sure. The rule says a pitcher cannot throw to an unoccupied base except for the purposes of making a play. This means that as soon as the runner makes a legitimate attempt to advance to the previously unoccupied base the pitcher can throw to that base.


This is from Evans.


Customs and Usage: If the umpire is convinced that a runner is making a bona fide effort to advance to an unoccupied base, then the pitcher is not guilty of throwing to an unoccupied base. See 8.05 End Notes Approved Ruling (b).


Play.

No outs...3-2 count...runners on first and second. The right-handed pitcher has properly stopped at the bottom of his stretch. As soon as his free foot starts up... each runner breaks for the next base. Without crossing the plane of the rubber with his free foot, the pitcher fires the ball to third in plenty of time to nail the surprised runner. Is this legal.

RULING: This is legal since a play was made. If the runner were not running, a balk should be called for throwing to an unoccupied base.



Tim.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by yankeesfan

i really thought you can't throw to an unoccupied base without stepping off the rubber. are you sure about this?

Yeah, we're sure. If you're not, you have the rule reference: check it out.

[yankeesfan]

is this the same in fed rules also?

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by yankeesfan

is this the same in fed rules also?

Yes, all rule codes permit throwing to a base that is unoccupied at TOP for the purpose of making a play.

[thumpferee]

I'm just curious, did the pitcher turn and throw without stepping, or did he step toward second on the throw?

[bossman72]

Yankeesfan- just think about it. If this rule wasn't in place, the pitcher could not technically throw out a runner stealing. Also, runners would be fake stealing all the time to get pitchers to throw to 2nd and subsequently balk if the clause "for the purpose of making a play" wasn't in there.

Don't worry- this is a common myth. I had a coach tell me the same thing you thought and he was adimate it was a balk... sorry coach. haha

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by bossman72

Yankeesfan- just think about it. If this rule wasn't in place, the pitcher could not technically throw out a runner stealing.

Sure he could: F1 could step off before throwing to 2B (although then for purposes of the balk rule he is not "pitcher" but just an "infielder"). Many people seem to think that if the pitcher does anything other than come to the plate then he must step off. Many people do not know the balk rule.

[bossman72]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Sure he could: F1 could step off before throwing to 2B (although then for purposes of the balk rule he is not "pitcher" but just an "infielder"). Many people seem to think that if the pitcher does anything other than come to the plate then he must step off. Many people do not know the balk rule.

Yes- exactly.